"Taking 20"
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It seems that there's a lot of new NWN information in the June 2001 issue of Computer Games...One of the more interesting bits (to me anyway :) was that you always "take 20" except when in combat.
...For those unfamiliar, "taking 20" was put into the PnP game as a shortcut. This was so everyone didn't sit around waiting for a player to roll a high number for some "necessary", but non-exciting skill check. The player mearly spends 20 times the normal time in exchange for assuming he would have rolled a 20. Instead of 1 round per attempt, he takes 20 rounds. This can only be done when there is no harm in failing...
- "We found that, in pen and paper games, that if you're in combat, you don't Take Twenty. Other than that, 100% of the time you Take Twenty. So, Neverwinter is going to reflect that. You Take Twenty unless you're in combat, in which case you roll the dice and see what happens." - page 57
-Trent Oster
...The more I think about this, the more it worries me. Please someone tell me that I've read this wrong or that this is at least going to be an option that the DM can turn off. Let me explain my objections.
On first look the fact that a character always takes 20 on skills when not in combat is not such a big deal, but there are at least two types of situations when it's use is going to cause me problems.
Firstly, opposed skill checks, such as Move Silently/Listen, Hide/Spot and Disguise/Spot. In a P'n'P game, if a lower level Rogue tries to sneak past a higher level Rogue he at least has a chance of getting away with it - he might roll well while the higher level character fluffs it. But if they are both assumed to roll 20 then the higher level Rogue is always going to catch the lower level one out. That's just destroyed one of the best moments in a RPG - making it against the odds.
Secondly, when setting the DC for such things as picking a lock, spotting a trap or disarming a trap, I'm faced with the fact that I will know EXACTLY what the Rogue's skill result is going to be. So when I set the DC for the lock, what I'm actually deciding is whether the PCs are going to be able to get into it or not. Now this might be useful in a few instances (i.e. the party REALLY isn't strong enough to take on what's behind the door yet) but as a general rule it makes it too easy to rail-road.
Looking at the examples I've just put together, it also strikes me that the rule is particularly harsh on Rogues. Many of their strongest abilities are non-combat skills. Personally, if I was trying to play a Rogue, particularly one who like to take risks and live by the seat of her pants, I'd feel cheated if I knew that the outcome of most of my character's actions were effectively determined before I'd even got my lock picks out.
Am I being over-sensitive, or is this making anyone else nervous?
- Hi folks,
Thanks for the interest and concern regarding our implementation of the 'Take 20' system. Don't worry, Trent's comments in the Computer Games article outline the general intent of the system but they don't get into the actual nuts and bolts of our implementation (which is still underway, by the way). That's where these sorts of concerns are getting addressed.
No need to worry,
Rob Bartel
