Interesting Tactic for a Cleric Vs. Undead

Philos · Post by **Philos** » Tue May 10, 2005 12:10 pm

**Spoilers Below**

Many have probably discovered this tactic before but the results were so interesting and humorous I had to write about it. Initiating the "Turn Dead" feature on the Cleric and then have a mage cast invisibility on him produced some marvelous results. The cleric can freely walk about through waves of undead. Turning or destroying as he/she goes without blowing the invisibility. Some undead are unaffected by turning, (revenants, greater mummies, crypt things), but many of them cannot see invisible creatures. I thought it rather humorous to have him go into an area and watch the wights groan and explode as he merely walked by.

SPOILER

In Trials of the Luremaster, there is a huge crypt loaded with tons of undead. By this time my cleric had reached 19th (or 20th) level. It was great fun (to me) to have him simply walk about and watch the bone/blade skeletons crumble into heaps, the wights explode, and ghosts turn into vapor. There was little left for the rest of the party to dispose of but that was certainly fun and a fast way to clear the crypt.

Erenor · Post by **Erenor** » Fri May 13, 2005 12:01 am

This is an excellent suggestions, and I think you can turn the greater undead, but you ened to be of a really high level to do so, which is difficult with normal sized parties.

Rudar Dimble · Post by **Rudar Dimble** » Fri May 13, 2005 12:11 am

Well, isn't it a bit cheesy? IMHO it is

CFM · Post by **CFM** » Fri May 13, 2005 10:13 am

The game engine probably should have treated the Undead Turning ability the same way as attacking: as performing an action that would negate the invisibility.

Philos · Post by **Philos** » Fri May 13, 2005 11:10 am

Turning Undead and the game engine

CFM, you're probably right about how the game engine should have been programmed. If I had been DM'ing a live D&D game I would certainly treat the situation that way (blowing the invis that is) when the turning is performed. I also would limit movement, while turning, more than the game engine does (if it does at all). Seems to me that turning should involve a great deal of focus and concentration. I would think it hard to focus on one's deity while strolling around at full speed.

In the Fiend Folio (where crypt things and revenants were introduced many years ago) it said that, although undead, crypt things were immune to turning. They are only about a 5 HD monster if I remember correctly. I think the same is true for revenants (immunity to turning) although they are around 10-12 HD. My cleric was around 20th level and he vaporized ghosts (a 10 HD monster) but could do nothing to the revenants or crypt things. Don't know anything about the greater mummies background, so I don't have a clue there as to why he couldn't turn them. The greater mummies were also able to see my cleric while invisible, the revenants couldn't.

Even if it strays into the territory of being cheesy, (not quite conceeding that point yet) it made me laugh the whole way through the crypt in TotL. And well, a game is supposed to be fun afterall. Nothing like walking by an undead and watching it exploding/crumble while not even know what hit it. The groans and moans added even more to it.

Rudar Dimble · Post by **Rudar Dimble** » Fri May 13, 2005 11:59 am

Oh, I certainly believe it is fun to watch

, I don't doubt that

But as you said it yourself, you would not allow it in a RL D&D session, so that's why I prefer not to take advantage of this 'flaw' in the game engine. Off course the game is all about fun. Even if you get the most fun from using cheat codes and playing in god mode (which I'm sure you don't, it's just an example), there's nothing wrong with it...it's all about the fun

Philos · Post by **Philos** » Fri May 13, 2005 3:20 pm

Game Flaws

While I would never consider using cheat codes (you were correct in suspecting that to be so), I suppose I don't feel quite so bad about taking advantage of an occasional game flaw, in terms of how the game reflects RL D&D, because the game itself seems to gets away with a lot that I would never have allowed as a DM (going back to that example) and that violate the 2nd edition rules that the game is based on. The flaws work far more in the "monsters" favor. So I guess in the long run "to me" they balance out somewhat.

As an example, I have NEVER been able to get Invisibility Purge or See Invisible to work. There were a couple of places in Dorn's Deep where I was positive there were thieves skulking in shadows. Either of those spells should have allowed me to see or unmask at least some of them. I have reloaded a saved game and tried a number of times, but nothing ever happens. At one point I threw a fireball up a corridor ahead of the party, nothing happened. Yet, when I started up the corridor, gee surprise, look at the thieves pop out of shadows right where my fireball went off and they are all uninjured. Never knew being invisible also conferred fire resistence (which they didn't have because my mage hit one with an Aganazzer's Scorcher right off).

I know that no game can ever perfectly duplicate something as complex as D&D. So I try to take the game as it is (no modifications and no cheat codes) and play it as a "close" equivalent. Recognizing that some flaws work against me and a couple work for me. Slightly different philsophy than you I realize, but I am actually mostly in your camp and prefer to stick to D&D as written. The next time I go through the crypt I probably will just do it heads up.