We are at War

Scayde · Post by **Scayde** » Wed Mar 19, 2003 9:24 pm

We are atwar:The offensive has begun. May God protect the innocents. Let us not forget the soldiers. May the leaders of both nations have the wisdom to end this swiftly.

Originally by CNN
The United States and Britain have massed nearly 300,000 troops in the Persian Gulf region.

Earlier, Adm. Timothy Keating, commander of the U.S. 5th Fleet, said allied forces were prepared to carry out an "unprecedented" campaign: "If we go, the plans we have are unlike anything anyone has ever seen before."

In the hours leading up to the deadline, about a dozen U.S. and coalition warplanes dropped precision munitions on nearly a dozen Iraqi artillery pieces in the southern no-fly zone that could have been in range of American troops poised to invade southern Iraq, Pentagon officials told CNN.

Tamerlane · Post by **Tamerlane** » Wed Mar 19, 2003 9:28 pm

Watching it right now, there is a media saturation right now.

I hope our boys and those of our allies get home quickly and safely but I fear for the Iraqi people.

EDIT - Bombers have already made precision strikes on targets in Baghdad

josh · Post by **josh** » Wed Mar 19, 2003 9:31 pm

I'm at Uni at the moment. Don't have a TV handy so I'll guess I'll have to rely on you people to keep me informed.

josh · Post by **josh** » Wed Mar 19, 2003 9:33 pm

Wait, I just remembered there is a TV in the Bridge Lounge. I'll duck over there and have a sqiz.

Tamerlane · Post by **Tamerlane** » Wed Mar 19, 2003 9:34 pm

@ josh.

Well according to CNN, the bunker busters was an attempt to hit Saddam and his inner group apparently. Defence officals call it an "Attack Of Opportunity".

dragon wench · Post by **dragon wench** » Wed Mar 19, 2003 9:35 pm

When will they ever learn?

My heart bleeds......

Scayde · Post by **Scayde** » Wed Mar 19, 2003 9:37 pm

Here is a transcript of President Bush's Speech

Der-draigen · Post by **Der-draigen** » Wed Mar 19, 2003 9:42 pm

@DW -- Your post reminds me of an old Peter, Paul & Mary song.

Where have all the flowers gone?
Long time passing.
Where have all the flowers gone
Long time ago?
Where have all the flowers gone?
Gone to young girls, every one.
When will they ever learn?
When will they ever learn?

Where have all the young girls gone?
Long time passing.
Where have all the young girls gone
Long time ago?
Where have all the young girls gone?
Gone to young men, every one.
When will they ever learn?
When will they ever learn?

Where have all the young men gone?
Long time passing.
Where have all the young men gone
Long time ago?
Where have all the young men gone?
Gone to soldiers, every one.
When will they ever learn?
When will they ever learn?

Where have all the soldiers gone?
Long time passing.
Where have all the soldiers gone
Long time ago?
Where have all the soldiers gone?
Gone to graveyards, every one.
When will they ever learn?
When will they ever learn?

Where have all the graveyards gone?
Long time passing.
Where have all the graveyards gone
Long time ago?
Where have all the graveyards gone?
Gone to flowers, every one.
When will they ever learn?
When will they ever learn?

dragon wench · Post by **dragon wench** » Wed Mar 19, 2003 10:00 pm

@99
I have rarely ever seen you post something in which you appear capable of disagreeing with somebody in a civil manner, therefore I refuse to engage you further. I have better things to do with my time than carry on conversations with blinkered bigots.

Der Draigen...
Yes.. I was actually thinking of that piece when I posted.... I am watching all of this on TV..... I return to something I said some time back.... Bush and his henchmen are nothing but thugs... it is they who should be tried for war crimes...

fable · Post by **fable** » Wed Mar 19, 2003 10:01 pm

@at99, I've deleted another of your posts. This one was an effort by you to again express pro-war propaganda, and under the circumstances--where a great many lives are at stake, on both sides--in extremely poor taste in this particular thread.

Scayde · Post by **Scayde** » Wed Mar 19, 2003 10:08 pm

Thank you fable. *HUG*

Interesting note, An iraqi news site I have been monitoring, to get an idea of the views of the Iraqis, is now a dead link. If anyone knows a reputable news site which focuses the Mid-Eastern view point, and is current and timely in reporting the events. Would you please post the link.

dragon wench · Post by **dragon wench** » Wed Mar 19, 2003 10:26 pm

Scayde,
you might try looking for something coming out of Jordan or Egypt.... Though.. it would not surprise me if everything coming from the Middle East is being blocked...

HighLordDave · Post by **HighLordDave** » Wed Mar 19, 2003 11:01 pm

The major news outlets (I saw it first on CNN, but it was echoed on MSNBC and NBC) earlier reported an "attack of opportunity" on a "leadership target" that was called a "decapitation strike" by a reported government official.

This is, of course, a euphamism for an assassination attempt. CNN is reporting that the likely target was a command and control center where Saddam Hussein may have been located.

I would like to pose a couple of questions for no one in particular, but as something for us to think about.

First, if Saddam Hussein was indeed the target, and let's assume for a minute that he was killed (because the kinds of precision-guided munitions that were reportedly used kill a target over 90% of the time if they hit the correct target), what does that do the war? Will we still invade? Will we occupy the country while a new government is formed and installed? Who should preside over the transitional goverment? The US? The UN? The Iraqis themselves?

Second, if Saddam Hussein was the target, what precedent does this set for the United States assassinating the head of state of another country. Remember that the Ford administration promulgated a rule which prohibited the specific targeting of foreign heads of state. That's not to say that the stated target wasn't Saddam Hussein's cell phone (which he happened to have in his back pocket), but it seems to me that if Dubya has pronounced Saddam Hussein "fair game", then what's to stop another country from going after the President of the United States?

POTUS is one of the most vulnerable leaders in the world. If our government has sanctioned the assassination of another head of state, aren't we opening up this president and his successors to even more danger?

Tamerlane · Post by **Tamerlane** » Wed Mar 19, 2003 11:12 pm

Originally posted by Scayde
Interesting note, An iraqi news site I have been monitoring, to get an idea of the views of the Iraqis, is now a dead link. If anyone knows a reputable news site which focuses the Mid-Eastern view point, and is current and timely in reporting the events. Would you please post the link.

Saddam is to give a radio address in the coming hours. The government has already called the attacks a, "stupidity of aggression". I guess it will be just one more time for Saddam to go into his tirade before the allied forces shut down the communications grid over Iraq.

at99 · Post by **at99** » Wed Mar 19, 2003 11:35 pm

Originally posted by fable
@at99, I've deleted another of your posts. This one was an effort by you to again express pro-war propaganda, and under the circumstances--where a great many lives are at stake, on both sides--in extremely poor taste in this particular thread.

I actually forgot what I said exactly but now I am baffled. How an earth did you conjure up this idea about poor taste or pro-war propaganda? I dont remember trying offend anyone in any form at all (directly or inderectly),

care to refresh my memory and clarify how I achieved this?

Why was I flamed directly, I dont remeber calling anyone an idiot but no one should call me one either.

at99 · Post by **at99** » Wed Mar 19, 2003 11:41 pm

Originally posted by dragon wench
@99
I have rarely ever seen you post something in which you appear capable of disagreeing with somebody in a civil manner, therefore I refuse to engage you further. I have better things to do with my time than carry on conversations with blinkered bigots.
...

I dont remember doing anything of the sort?

How and why did you think I was out to offend you?
I dont like being flamed and I dont call people offensive names?

maybe the war has made people a little hostile, I think I was a little over the top the other day about the events

Tybaltus · Post by **Tybaltus** » Thu Mar 20, 2003 12:35 am

Surprise, surprise....Well everything was simply just prelude to this, anyways. Ive seen it coming since the first mumblings of it occured a few months back. What has happened today just makes it official.

Well this war will cause more detriment over the long run then the short run.

Certainly, my condolences go out to any innocent taken down in the war, and any soldier that comes to their end. Its a horrible way to go about things, war is. And I feel badly for anyone who has to witness the horrors of war.

Peace.

fable · Post by **fable** » Thu Mar 20, 2003 12:55 am

@Beldin--deleted. Not for content, but for language. Please watch that. Read the rules, although I strongly suspect you know exactly what word you used that got by the board.

Beldin · Post by **Beldin** » Thu Mar 20, 2003 1:07 am

Originally posted by Tybaltus

Certainly, my condolences go out to any innocent taken down in the war, and any soldier that comes to their end. Its a horrible way to go about things, war is. And I feel badly for anyone who has to witness the horrors of war.

Peace.

Well said, Tybby !

I have nothing to add, except maybe that I hope that the citizens of the U.S.A. will show better judgement when the time comes to elect a new president. After all a slightly hedonistic president who likes to enjoy certain personal attentions administered by members of his staff might be better than one who engages in a war that could lead to WW III.

Just my 2 c.

Regards and condolences from a neutral country. And I hope we stay that way for the next several centuries.

WORRIES !

Beldin

at99 · Post by **at99** » Thu Mar 20, 2003 1:08 am

Originally posted by dragon wench
When will they ever learn?

My heart bleeds......

I remeber now,

I said something like 'sadam will never learn that is why we are at war' in reply to
'when will sadam ever learn' ('they' meaning iraq)

I still dont see the problem that got the hostile response, anyway make of this what you will.