Something Awful reviews NWN

cjdevito · Post by **cjdevito** » Tue Jun 25, 2002 6:53 pm

Lowtax of http://www.somethingawful.com reviews Neverwinter Nights:

"Okay, let me get this right out of the way here: I really don't like this game. At all. In any facet. I'm sure this will generate a barn full of flame email from people whose fulltime occupation is producing grease from their facial pores, but luckily I don't ever read my email. That is a wonderful example of my genius brain at work.

Neverwinter Nights is apparently a Dungeon and Dragons nerd's wet dream. You can build your dorky little dungeon and put monsters and crap in it and then be THE DUNGEON MASTER while other people walk around and get killed by the stupid traps you placed everywhere. The fact that you can be an online DUNGEON MASTER really appeals to a lot of people out there, which probably explains why the national murder rate is going up again. A whole bunch of nerds really want to be THE DUNGEON MASTER because it makes them feel powerful and like god, assuming god wears a tattered 3DFX t-shirt and fails to shower weekly.

Another big feature of Neverwinter Nights is the fact that it uses the Dungeons and Dragons 3rd Edition Rulebook. These rulebooks explain how many 20-sided dice you should roll when your Elf thinks about pottery. Everything in every D&D game requires you to roll 20-sided dice for at least seven hours. There's also something called a "saving throw," which I think is an Olympic sport. Each rulebook released includes more banal and boring requirements to roll 20-sided dice over and over again. In fact, I think D&D games are being released as large boxes containing a bunch of dice and a note that says "have fun!" Neverwinter Nights uses the 3rd Edition Rulebook to make gameplay turn into a giant orgy of mathematics and 20-sided dice and Elves. Oh yeah, and it takes roughly three hours to simply create a character because there's a billion different traits and qualities to choose from (since being Lawful Good makes a huge difference compared to Unlawful Good Neutral Chaotic Evil Hungry Neutral Well-Done). You have a lot of time to obsess over your stupid stats when you walk through any doorway and experience the exciting roleplaying feature of "long ingame pauses to load the next map."

Although I only played the game for two hours, it felt like the equivalent of 40 hours in any other game. If you're some goober who enjoys numbers, frequently gloats in public about your Armor Class, or wants to be THE DUNGEON MASTER, this game is for you. If you're somebody who wants to play a quick game and then quit after 30 minutes, you should stay the hell away from Neverwinter Nights because it takes at least that long just to look at your spellbook. "

Insightful and inciteful as always

fable · Post by **fable** » Tue Jun 25, 2002 7:11 pm

Not surprisingly, the author of that dull, repetitive and self-conceited prose also wrote, "Let me toss up a little disclaimer: I, by default, hate RPGs." I suppose that makes his opinions on 'em worth hearing.

Amidala · Post by **Amidala** » Tue Jun 25, 2002 7:16 pm

Do me a favor

Do not post such a rubbish again.
The poor soul that has written this "text" has disqualified itself for any discussion.
Insulting everyone who is not of its opinion and stating that it is not reading its email anyway brings up pictures in my mind of a little kid that has his fingers in his ears and is screaming : "Naa, naa, naa, I dont hear you."

Aegis · Post by **Aegis** » Tue Jun 25, 2002 7:41 pm

Re: Do me a favor

Originally posted by Amidala
Do not post such a rubbish again.
The poor soul that has written this "text" has disqualified itself for any discussion.
Insulting everyone who is not of its opinion and stating that it is not reading its email anyway brings up pictures in my mind of a little kid that has his fingers in his ears and is screaming : "Naa, naa, naa, I dont hear you."

You seem to have a lot of angst towards anyone who seems to look down on this game. I think this was a great thing to have posted on the forums, as it shows that all the hype generated for the game was, in fact, just hype. While the game itself is good in terms of gameplay (or so I'm told

), it is, as my friend was telling me, a game that generally only appeals to DnD players.

On these forums, we try to promote people having different opinions, and this is a prime example of one of those opinions. Does it coincide with yours? Of course not, but thats why it is an opnion. What I'm trying to get at here, is don't be so jumpy. Just because someone doesn't like the game, thats no need to be rude to them, or the poster of someone's opinion.

fable · Post by **fable** » Tue Jun 25, 2002 7:59 pm

You seem to have a lot of angst towards anyone who seems to look down on this game. I think this was a great thing to have posted on the forums, as it shows that all the hype generated for the game was, in fact, just hype.

@Aegis, you do yourself a disservice by associating your anger at an inability to run the game for technical reasons with a loud-mouthed kid who simply uses his website to flame just about everything and everyone, all the time, without imagination, talent or reason. Your opinions are more valuable than that.

AngusThermopole · Post by **AngusThermopole** » Tue Jun 25, 2002 8:07 pm

Not that I would necessarily agree with anything said in this review, but I think it's intention was to be humorous not insulting. Ah, you reply, such humor is only suited for childish morons who can only belittle to make themselves feel superior. That would probably be an accurate assessment in this case.

I credit cjdevito with supplying us with a chance to take a look at the view that points out the nerdish aspect of RPG. There is no doubt of that aspect. The whole RPG intrigue is that of being something other than what we are or can be in RT. When you actually start to believe that any status, rank, level, event, whatever in RP is worth a damn, then you border on that extreme. Not that there is anything wrong with that. If that's what floats your boat, and no one gets hurt in the process, then so be it.

But never, ever foget to be able to laugh at yourself.

fable · Post by **fable** » Tue Jun 25, 2002 8:18 pm

Originally posted by AngusThermopole
But never, ever foget to be able to laugh at yourself.

There's honest, wry wit, sometimes sharp, sometimes whimsical, capable of skewering the pretentions of the mighty and the wild fantasies of the silly...but that review ain't it.

Endless exaggeration and name-calling has been committed to print for more than two thousand years, but it's never truly regarded as funny by anybody save its writer and his/her in-group.

Now, if you want to discuss the real thing, go over to SYM (Speak Your Mind), and start a topic about humor. I'll post some Robert Benchley, James Thurber, Dorothy Parker and Ring Lardner, and we'll talk.

AngusThermopole · Post by **AngusThermopole** » Tue Jun 25, 2002 8:26 pm

@Fable

I believe I expressed an opinion similar to yours on the humor in the review. My point was directed more to the anger expressed on cjdevito posting it.

THE JAKER · Post by **THE JAKER** » Tue Jun 25, 2002 8:31 pm

For those of you who don't go know Something Awful, it is a humor site...a good one too. My favorite features are Photoshop Friday (go by on Fridays and check it out, you will laugh, you will cry), and of course the ramblings of JEFF K!!!!111 - l33t DOOD AND GEANRAL GAEMING BNO VIVANTE!!!

Don't take the review seriously though, this is a trick. They do this regularly, writing an insulting, innacurate review of somthing like NWN or AOTC, then propogate it on the Internet with the intention of luring unsuspecting die-hard fans into flame wars. It is just an attention getting device, the review is not serious and is intentionally innaccurate. They are just doing this to stir up the D&D fans so they can mock them.....some of their commentary on Everquest has been truly hilarious

average joe · Post by **average joe** » Tue Jun 25, 2002 10:18 pm

Re: Re: Do me a favor

Originally posted by Aegis
You seem to have a lot of angst towards anyone who seems to look down on this game. I think this was a great thing to have posted on the forums, as it shows that all the hype generated for the game was, in fact, just hype. While the game itself is good in terms of gameplay (or so I'm told ), it is, as my friend was telling me, a game that generally only appeals to DnD players.

On these forums, we try to promote people having different opinions, and this is a prime example of one of those opinions. Does it coincide with yours? Of course not, but thats why it is an opnion. What I'm trying to get at here, is don't be so jumpy. Just because someone doesn't like the game, thats no need to be rude to them, or the poster of someone's opinion.

Aegis, truly, Amidala said nothing about having a dislike for the person because of their view of NeverWinter Nights. I'm almost under the impression that you only read the first line of her post and then jumped right in. In actuality, she said she didn't appreciate his insults directed towards anyone of a different opinion. I agree with the things you said in your post--about respecting other's opinions--but I think you lecturing Amidala is unnecessary for reasons I already stated.

By the way, I thought the review was pretty funny. Basically, because I know most people who enjoy rpgs and D&D are nothing like how he described us. Of if they are, I feel bad for them.

Maybe I'm just in denial.

Ylossakram · Post by **Ylossakram** » Tue Jun 25, 2002 10:20 pm

C'mon guys, you can't take that seriously

Obviously it's a fun site and i bet every single reviews by it is on the same line ... just look at the site name ... "Awful reviews" ... what would you expect, them to say "NWN, the best crpg ever on earth" ?

Rhino · Post by **Rhino** » Tue Jun 25, 2002 10:21 pm

Bad review?

I thought that was kind of funny

It's good to be able to step back from something and laugh at it. At least, that's what my therapist tells me

I'm pretty sure the guy was just trolling for a flame war with it, and some of the reactions show he was successful.

"But what do YOU think of the game, Rhino?" you might ask. "After all, you've been waiting for three bloody years for the stupid disks!"

Well, I'll tell you. The toolset will rock. I think, over time, we will be able to develop some real kick-ass content with it. As far as the single-player game goes, it seems to be average in storyline, but there's only so much you can do with a canned module and no DM story-wise. So story I ignore. Some of the stuff seems pretty power-gamey, but the majority of this game's customers, judging from the lineup at the local stores, will be 16 and under anyhow, and most of them seem to need things like free teleporting to temples where you can heal for free and find your dead henchmen miraculously alive for free and your lost plot devices appear for free and....well, you get my drift. If you use these items you can almost never die.

The graphics aren't up to par with other new games, probably because it's taken so freaking long to put it out

If you want eye candy, wait for Doom III, this won't bend you over and call you Judy.

The sound is good, Bioware always pays good attention to sound.

In short, if it didn't have the toolset I wouldn't have bought it. But then, if it didn't have the toolset I wouldn't have followed this since August '99, or created Argyle.....

cjdevito · Post by **cjdevito** » Tue Jun 25, 2002 10:59 pm

I'm pretty sure the guy was just trolling for a flame war with it,

Actually, you'd be wrong on that. I was gratified that you and several others understood the post though: it was humor that poked fun of the pretentiousness that seems to surround NWN. Now, don't get me wrong. I bought the game, I'm playing the game, I'm enjoying the game. But... it's a game. It's not the cure for cancer, proof of intelligent extra-terrestrial life, or even a book entitled 'What Women Really Think'. The amount of crusading and pontificating, the zealousness of those who want to brand it 'Best Game Ever' (insert Simpsons comic shop guy voice here), the opinion wars that this game seems to generate.... well, they deserve a good skewering. Because at the end of the day, it's still just a game.

So relax, realize neither the review nor the site is meant to be taken seriously, and realize that if you can't laugh at your own sacred cows, who elses can you laugh at?

cjdevito · Post by **cjdevito** » Tue Jun 25, 2002 11:09 pm

and of course the ramblings of JEFF K!!!!111 - l33t DOOD AND GEANRAL GAEMING BNO VIVANTE!!!

Speaking of, let us all not forget that Bioware and Black Isle actually like and approve of Something Awful. Hence the Jeff K easter egg cyclops in Icewind Dale.

I dunno though, Jaker. Your Jeff K impression is off somehow. It's just too.... legible

average joe · Post by **average joe** » Tue Jun 25, 2002 11:11 pm

Well, he might not have been "trolling for a flame war," but he definitely couldn't expect to escape uncinged for posting that, no matter how lightly it was intended to be taken.

Xandax · Post by **Xandax** » Wed Jun 26, 2002 3:40 am

Re: Re: Do me a favor

Originally posted by Aegis
<snip>
I think this was a great thing to have posted on the forums, as it shows that all the hype generated for the game was, in fact, just hype. While the game itself is good in terms of gameplay (or so I'm told ), it is, as my friend was telling me, a game that generally only appeals to DnD players.
<snip>

Of course a RPG game appeals to roleplayers.
I would infact say that it is the target segment.

As for the review, it is IMO it is obvious that the author likes action games and only wrote the review as a means to get attention:

Oh yeah, and it takes roughly three hours to simply create a character because there's a billion different traits and qualities to choose from

If you're somebody who wants to play a quick game and then quit after 30 minutes, you should stay the hell away from Neverwinter Nights because it takes at least that long just to look at your spellbook.

The review posted has nothing to do with a review of NwN and even less to do with "exposing" the hype surronding NwN.
All it states is the fact that the author don't like roleplayers as a general, wich he spends a lot of time bad-mouthing.

. A whole bunch of nerds really want to be THE DUNGEON MASTER because it makes them feel powerful and like god, assuming god wears a tattered 3DFX t-shirt and fails to shower weekly.

Thus I can't give any validation to this person and his views.

NeoCount · Post by **NeoCount** » Wed Jun 26, 2002 3:51 am

YESSSSSSSSSSS!!!

Oh mighty brain - thanks for letting us know that we are nurds.

Mr Sleep · Post by **Mr Sleep** » Wed Jun 26, 2002 4:55 am

I think everyone in their course through the internet finds something awful, i really enjoy their awful link of the day and am waiting for the day i actually manage to get a site on there

If you take his comments seriously i think you are playing into his hands and are confirming his accusations, ignore it or laugh at it, that is my opinion

fable · Post by **fable** » Wed Jun 26, 2002 6:12 am

Originally posted by Mr Sleep
If you take his comments seriously i think you are playing into his hands and are confirming his accusations, ignore it or laugh at it, that is my opinion

That's not the problem, @Sleep: it's the fact that the writer does it so *badly.*

There's some website out there whose address I forget that attempts the same sort of thing on a wider scale, but with far greater resources of intelligence and wit. NWN and RPGs in general have nerds among 'em that pay a lot of attention to numbers? RPG PCs require some tweaking? My! What original and imaginatively humorous conclusions! And presented with such clever slyness, deadpan sarcasm, epigramatic insight, and subtle innuendo...! Shyeah, right.

THE JAKER · Post by **THE JAKER** » Wed Jun 26, 2002 7:06 am

Matter o' taste, innit?