Further to a programme i watched the other night called Richard Jobson's Movie Talk i would like to ask GB's patrons their opinion.
The question is:
Is Star Wars really an SF movie. And how does one characterise an SF movie.
BTW i am not trying to start a flame war over whether Star Wars is any good, most of us agree it has some good features, i just wonder how many people think it is an SF movie, and why.
Mr Sleep's Movie Talk
Mr Sleep's Movie Talk
I'd have to get drunk every night and talk about virility...And those Pink elephants I'd see.
I don't actually consider Star Wars to be an SF movie it is more of a fantasy movie than actually dealing with a concept or an idiology, it's basically young white boy rises to ascendancy because he defeats the evil emporer, not really the kind of story you find in SF, definately more of a fantasy feel
I'd have to get drunk every night and talk about virility...And those Pink elephants I'd see.
Star Wars isn’t sci-fi, it’s myth set to a sci-fi backdrop. The Star Wars story is as old as human history and contains many items more commonly found in fantasy pictures: Knights with shining sabers, evil warriors clad in black armor, magic and mysticism (the Force). I’ve read a few Star Wars novels and IMO they stink. That’s because the writers make the mistake of assuming that it’s a sci-fi environment. Star Trek is sci-fi; Star Wars is modern myth.
Nature’s first green is gold,
Her hardest hue to hold.
Her early leaf’s a flower;
But only so an hour.
Then leaf subsides to leaf.
So Eden sank to grief,
So dawn goes down to day.
Nothing gold can stay.
Her hardest hue to hold.
Her early leaf’s a flower;
But only so an hour.
Then leaf subsides to leaf.
So Eden sank to grief,
So dawn goes down to day.
Nothing gold can stay.
ROFLMAO!!! I like this girl!Originally posted by Georgi:
<STRONG>Erm, actually I think you'll find it took place a long time ago in a galaxy far, far away...
You've got style Georgi! In regards to Star wars... I'd say it's Sci Fi due to the fact that it doesn't really fit in with any other category that I can think of. (IMO)
[ 06-12-2001: Message edited by: Vehemence ]
Cartoon Law III
Any body passing through solid matter will leave a perforation conforming to its perimeter. Also called the silhouette of passage, this phenomenon is the speciality of victims of directed-pressure explosions and of reckless cowards who are so eager to escape that they exit directly through the wall of a house, leaving a cookie-cutout-perfect hole. The threat of skunks or matrimony often catalyzes this reaction.
Any body passing through solid matter will leave a perforation conforming to its perimeter. Also called the silhouette of passage, this phenomenon is the speciality of victims of directed-pressure explosions and of reckless cowards who are so eager to escape that they exit directly through the wall of a house, leaving a cookie-cutout-perfect hole. The threat of skunks or matrimony often catalyzes this reaction.
Well no, it's just that its most fitting to the SCI-FI category. Fantasy probably a little bit less. I say Sci-fi due to the large technological advancements they have. To me, fantasy is always less technologically based... but that's just how I perceive it.Originally posted by Mr Sleep:
<STRONG>But just because it hasn't got a category it is lumped with SF?</STRONG>
[ 06-12-2001: Message edited by: Vehemence ]
Cartoon Law III
Any body passing through solid matter will leave a perforation conforming to its perimeter. Also called the silhouette of passage, this phenomenon is the speciality of victims of directed-pressure explosions and of reckless cowards who are so eager to escape that they exit directly through the wall of a house, leaving a cookie-cutout-perfect hole. The threat of skunks or matrimony often catalyzes this reaction.
Any body passing through solid matter will leave a perforation conforming to its perimeter. Also called the silhouette of passage, this phenomenon is the speciality of victims of directed-pressure explosions and of reckless cowards who are so eager to escape that they exit directly through the wall of a house, leaving a cookie-cutout-perfect hole. The threat of skunks or matrimony often catalyzes this reaction.
Sorry Sleepy, I took a while to write and your post wasn't there when I started.Originally posted by Mr Sleep:
<STRONG>This is the conclusion i came to (only less eloquently), in that case what does make an SF movie and could you name a few examples.
To me a sci-fi movie is about how mankind interacts with new discoveries or inventions. They tend to be more ponderous and introspective then many motion pictures and generally ask profound questions (look at shows like Star Trek or the Outer Limits). There are many action films set to a science fiction backdrop, just as Star Wars is a myth in a sci-fi universe, but to me a true sci-fi movie is one that takes a stab at asking some unusual question about new possible situations (like the writings of Isaac Asimov and H.G. Wells).
Nature’s first green is gold,
Her hardest hue to hold.
Her early leaf’s a flower;
But only so an hour.
Then leaf subsides to leaf.
So Eden sank to grief,
So dawn goes down to day.
Nothing gold can stay.
Her hardest hue to hold.
Her early leaf’s a flower;
But only so an hour.
Then leaf subsides to leaf.
So Eden sank to grief,
So dawn goes down to day.
Nothing gold can stay.
But doesn't star wars do that by showing a possible existince in a science fiction reality with millenium falcons, poweful jedi and evil emporers? Still, it does have an awful lot of fantasy elements...Originally posted by Kayless:
<STRONG><snip> but to me a true sci-fi movie is one that takes a stab at asking some unusual question about new possible situations (like the writings of Isaac Asimov and H.G. Wells).</STRONG>
Perhaps it's a sci-fi-fantasy?
Cartoon Law III
Any body passing through solid matter will leave a perforation conforming to its perimeter. Also called the silhouette of passage, this phenomenon is the speciality of victims of directed-pressure explosions and of reckless cowards who are so eager to escape that they exit directly through the wall of a house, leaving a cookie-cutout-perfect hole. The threat of skunks or matrimony often catalyzes this reaction.
Any body passing through solid matter will leave a perforation conforming to its perimeter. Also called the silhouette of passage, this phenomenon is the speciality of victims of directed-pressure explosions and of reckless cowards who are so eager to escape that they exit directly through the wall of a house, leaving a cookie-cutout-perfect hole. The threat of skunks or matrimony often catalyzes this reaction.
The technology in Star Wars is a means to an end. It never really delves into issues like whether it’s morally right to keep sentient droids as slaves, something a science fiction movie would capitalize on. In fact a subtle undercurrent in Star Wars is that technology (the very heart of sci-fi) is bad. The good guys have Ewok allies and ride tontons in the snow. The Empire uses ATAT walkers and shuns aliens. Star Wars has sci-fi elements but that's not really what it's about.Originally posted by Vehemence:
<STRONG>But doesn't star wars do that by showing a possible existince in a science fiction reality with millenium falcons, poweful jedi and evil emporers? Still, it does have an awful lot of fantasy elements...
Perhaps it's a sci-fi-fantasy?
Nature’s first green is gold,
Her hardest hue to hold.
Her early leaf’s a flower;
But only so an hour.
Then leaf subsides to leaf.
So Eden sank to grief,
So dawn goes down to day.
Nothing gold can stay.
Her hardest hue to hold.
Her early leaf’s a flower;
But only so an hour.
Then leaf subsides to leaf.
So Eden sank to grief,
So dawn goes down to day.
Nothing gold can stay.
Good point Kayless... your one tough dude to argue with!
I'm guessing you were on the High School debating team?
Ok, back to the point... if it doesn't have the typical scifi elements... does it have the typical fantasy elements?
I'm guessing you were on the High School debating team?
Ok, back to the point... if it doesn't have the typical scifi elements... does it have the typical fantasy elements?
Cartoon Law III
Any body passing through solid matter will leave a perforation conforming to its perimeter. Also called the silhouette of passage, this phenomenon is the speciality of victims of directed-pressure explosions and of reckless cowards who are so eager to escape that they exit directly through the wall of a house, leaving a cookie-cutout-perfect hole. The threat of skunks or matrimony often catalyzes this reaction.
Any body passing through solid matter will leave a perforation conforming to its perimeter. Also called the silhouette of passage, this phenomenon is the speciality of victims of directed-pressure explosions and of reckless cowards who are so eager to escape that they exit directly through the wall of a house, leaving a cookie-cutout-perfect hole. The threat of skunks or matrimony often catalyzes this reaction.
Hi Skool? Wud'z that? I was born on a mountain, raised in a cave, trucking and f*cking are all I crave.Originally posted by Vehemence:
<STRONG>Good point Kayless... your one tough dude to argue with!
I'm guessing you were on the High School debating team?
It has the inherent mysticism (trust the force Luke!) and the general story structure, i.e. A young person on a quest, finding the truth of himself along the way. Black knights, wizards, magic, and swordplay proliferate the plot with plenty of soul-searching and mentoring as well. Star Wars would be a formulaic fantasy if it weren’t for it’s change of scenery (sci-fi instead of the typical environment ).Originally posted by Vehemence:
<STRONG>Ok, back to the point... if it doesn't have the typical scifi elements... does it have the typical fantasy elements?</STRONG>
Nature’s first green is gold,
Her hardest hue to hold.
Her early leaf’s a flower;
But only so an hour.
Then leaf subsides to leaf.
So Eden sank to grief,
So dawn goes down to day.
Nothing gold can stay.
Her hardest hue to hold.
Her early leaf’s a flower;
But only so an hour.
Then leaf subsides to leaf.
So Eden sank to grief,
So dawn goes down to day.
Nothing gold can stay.
LOL Kayless
Ok, your point about the fantasy in a sci-fi environment is well taken and I'd have to agree.
Ok, your point about the fantasy in a sci-fi environment is well taken and I'd have to agree.
Cartoon Law III
Any body passing through solid matter will leave a perforation conforming to its perimeter. Also called the silhouette of passage, this phenomenon is the speciality of victims of directed-pressure explosions and of reckless cowards who are so eager to escape that they exit directly through the wall of a house, leaving a cookie-cutout-perfect hole. The threat of skunks or matrimony often catalyzes this reaction.
Any body passing through solid matter will leave a perforation conforming to its perimeter. Also called the silhouette of passage, this phenomenon is the speciality of victims of directed-pressure explosions and of reckless cowards who are so eager to escape that they exit directly through the wall of a house, leaving a cookie-cutout-perfect hole. The threat of skunks or matrimony often catalyzes this reaction.
Sleep: I'm probably not the best one to argue a point on what constitutes a sci-fi or fantasy. I generally don't look at that stuff. I'm more interested in the movie, not what category it fits into.
From what I've seen though, Kayless paints a pretty good picture of what each should be, so I'm in agreement with him on that it's a fantasy in a sci-fi environment.
From what I've seen though, Kayless paints a pretty good picture of what each should be, so I'm in agreement with him on that it's a fantasy in a sci-fi environment.
Cartoon Law III
Any body passing through solid matter will leave a perforation conforming to its perimeter. Also called the silhouette of passage, this phenomenon is the speciality of victims of directed-pressure explosions and of reckless cowards who are so eager to escape that they exit directly through the wall of a house, leaving a cookie-cutout-perfect hole. The threat of skunks or matrimony often catalyzes this reaction.
Any body passing through solid matter will leave a perforation conforming to its perimeter. Also called the silhouette of passage, this phenomenon is the speciality of victims of directed-pressure explosions and of reckless cowards who are so eager to escape that they exit directly through the wall of a house, leaving a cookie-cutout-perfect hole. The threat of skunks or matrimony often catalyzes this reaction.