Making a fighter, suggestions on weapons and att.?

[NightFallMyriad]

So I want to make a really top-notch fighter chick. Currently I've got my red-headed girl in armour proficient and dual-wielding longsword and shortsword. But I'm not so sure I couldn't be doing better.

Longsword appeals because there are some decent long swords in the game. With dual-wielding though, you get into some conflicts. Like how if your offhand weapon isn't light (like the shortsword), there are -4 / -4 penalties even with ambidexterity and two-weapon fighting feat.
But if I want to go for the -2 / -2, I pretty much have to use the short sword - and waste feats on weapon focus (shortsword), weapon specialization (shortsword) and improved critical (shortsword).

So I'd need these feats just to dual wield longsword/shortsword nicely:

Weapon Proficiency (Martial)
Two-Weapon Fighting
Improved Two-Weapon Fighting
Weapon Finess (for the shortsword? Not sure about this)
Ambidexterity

Weapon Focus (Longsword)
Weapon Specialization (Longsword)
Improved Critical (Longsword)

Weapon Focus (Shortsword)
Weapon Specialization (Shortsword)
Improved Critical (Shortsword)

Yes, yes? And then of course all the other feats I would need to be a nice fighter type. I could always just stick with Longsword/Longsword, but again, then I get into the -4 / -4 penalties just for using two medium weapons.

Also, my stats are gonna look like this to start with for a human fighter:

STR - 15
DEX - 15
CON - 15
WIS - 10
INT - 10
CHR - 10

I think... STR, CON might be higher or lower, CHR might be lower. But I'd need at least 15 in dexterity just to push for ambi. Is it worth it?

Alternatively, I've been thinking about using a double-weapon. Specifically the Two-bladed Sword. It has nice damage, there are some nice ones in the game (keen, Lyons etc...), but I'm not so sure how the damage is dealt.

It's a two handed weapon right? So does the STR X 1.5 apply?
It's a double weapon yes? So does that mean it counts as mainhand/offhand?

If the latter is true, than I would wind up with feats like this:

Weapon Proficiency (Exotic)
Two-Weapon Fighting
Improved Two-Weapon Fighting
Ambidexterity

Weapon Focus (Two-bladed Sword)
Weapon Specialization (Two-bladed Sword)
Improved Critical (Two-bladed Sword)

Now, that's not as bad as it might look, but my first feats would have to be exotic, just to be able to use the thing, and the second focus, so's I'd be able to acquire one at the beginning of the game. I wouldn't be able to reap the benefits of the dual-wielding aspects of a double-weapon until later. And I'd still have to balance STR, DEX and CON somehow, unless I wanted to have the extreme misfortune of not being able to sign my own name or know of the existance of social skills (INT and CHR).

This seems like a pretty good idea. Especially since having a two-bladed sword is so much like Darth Maul and that REALLY FREAKY STONE GUY FROM NINJA SCROLLS! YEAH!!!
*Ahem*
Got a little carried away there...

Alternatively again, I was thinking of using the mighty Greatsword or Greataxe. Kind of unbefitting my well-tempered red-head, but then, a chick with that much steel is bound to look sexy, so who am I to argue?

With this kind of weapon focus, I don't have to worry about dex. In fact, I can use my dex points to go for more strength. If I can get my strength up to a natural 18, 19 or 20, then I can have str improving items carry me to victory on that STR X 1.5 damage rule. Imagine going 30 STR with a Greataxe doing base 1D12? That's some insane damage, yes!
Plus, I'd get to use my feats on things like powerattack, improved powerattack, knockdown and improved knockdown.

So feats would look like:

Weapon Proficiency (Martial)
Knockdown
Improved Knockdown
Power Attack
Improved Power Attack
Cleave

Weapon Focus (Great Sword/Axe)
Weapon Specialization (Great Sword/Axe)

The other feats could be poured into things like saving throw reducers (Ironwill, etc...) and AC modifiers (Dodge, mobility etc...).

I'm not sure with dual-wielding different weapons you'd have enough left over for what it would take to be a good fighter. And if you dual-wield like weapons (ie, two longsword, two shortswords, two rapiers, two kamas etc...), then either you're getting the -4 / -4 penalty, or you aren't doing enough damage because the weapons you're using are only doing 1D4 or 1D6 damage. Also, you are using a lot of feats and have to balance STR and CON with DEX.

With double-weapons, I'm not sure how it is. And I'm not too clear on how keen weapons are special. Attribute point balance issues like above?

With two-handers, you're doing massive damage, but are you hitting as much, and are you hitting at all? Would you be doing more damage per round with two weapons and the penalties? At least this way you can splurge with the STR though, which seems pretty cool.

In terms of role playing, I like the idea of having a female fighter with longsword as her main weapon.
I also think that a badass Darth Maul character using the double-sword would be mad fun to play.
And who could resist the warrior true to his one uber-six-foot-tall-behemoth-of-a-weapon greatsword or greataxe?

Decisions... decisions...

Thankfully, I've taken a long time to write this all out for everyone to read in hope that many of you will be able to suggest which style seems appropriate for someone who wants to be doing mad damage.
Surely someone will be able to offer some advice.

Thank you for reading!

Sincerely,
NightFall Myriad,

[Wyvern]

Yeah, that was a long post

My opion is:

- 12 dex
- greatsword
- dodge + mobility
- weapon focus + specialization: greatswords
- improved critical: greatswords
- some saving throw feat, the one u need most, I go for iron will.
- skill focus + mastery: discipline (if you have feats you don't know how to use)

That's abt it, I guess.

Of course, that's what I think.

[NightFallMyriad]

Thanks for the input.

Actually, I just got back from testing the greatsword, its pretty facking sweet.
I started myself off with power attack and greater power attack and weapon focus (on greatsword obviously) just to see what kind of damage I could do.

I hit the dummy in the training hall for 16 damage. That's nice compared to the 7-8 on a longsword or the 11-12 on a two-blader.

Then I got creative and tampered with the powerattack/greaterpowerattack.

I hit a goblin for 56 damage on a critical attack.

I'm thinking greatsword is a nice way to go!

Anyway, I'm still looking forward to the posts that are sure to talk about two dual-wield or to not dual-wield. I also wanna know more about double weapons and the dual-wield relations.

For now though, I think greatsword is the way to go.

Feats should look like this for me based on that:

Weapon Focus (greatsword)
Weapon Specialization (Greatsword)
Improved Critical (Greatsword)

Power Attack
Cleave
Greater Power Attack

Knockdown }
Greater Knockdown } Maybe these, not sure... suggestions?

Toughness
Dodge
Mobility

Fortitude }
Reflex }
Will } Probably in this order if I can't have all three

Will I need the skill masteries? I haven't used them thus far, are they any good?

Also, why 12 dex? Dex modifies your AC doesn't it? Seems like the higher the better, so I was gonna go like this for att. :

STR - 16
DEX - 14
CON - 16
WIS - 10
INT - 10
CHR - 8

So far, I haven't needed the charisma bonuses since I can persuade (or flirt, seeing as how I use a female char) my way out of things.

Other points:

About greataxes, they do 1D12 damage, that's more than the greatsword, but what does critical X3 mean?

Also, Katanas do the same amount of damage as greatswords, and can be used one in each hand. That's double the damage. But is it worth it compared to the feats and att. balance required to properly support dual-wielding?
Or, what about katana + shield? Same damage as the greatsword but with the added comfort of a tower shield for AC.

Which is better???

The possibilities are almost limitless! Which is why this is driving me nuts.

*Sigh*

I think I'll try greatsword out and see how it plays for awhile. If I like it, maybe I'll keep going with it.

[Wyvern]

Sorry, I can't write a lot now'cause I'm at work but just to clarify one thing: heavy armor allows only for +1 dex armor bonus. So, it doesn't matter if you have 12 or 16 dex, you still get only the +1 bonus. Of course, it makes a difference when it comes to saving throws (I think, anyone could confirm?) but you better take lightning reflexes than more dexterity.

Of course, that's if u want the most powerful fighter, doesn't have much to do with role-playing

Maybe more tonite, from home

[NightFallMyriad]

True, my fighter will be wearing full plate. So how much dex do you need to get that bonus? I'll have to sit down somewhere and figure it out...

But someone suggested that since lighter armor allows for more dex bonus AC, you could have high dex, use something like chainmail and have a higher AC than full plate. I suppose that's something to look into as well...

I'll try to find it, then I'll post more.

No one wants to comment on dual-wielding, double-weapons, keen weapons or X3 vs 19-20?

[NightFallMyriad]

Alrighty...

I checked out the armor class and dex bonuses. There is a thread called "Armour Class" a few pages back if you wanna go look for it. Anyway, it seems like 12 dex is all I will need. I should check the bonuses on it. I'll find the breaking point between no modifier and +1 modifier and go with the smallest +1 I can get. I think that's 12, so it works out well. The other points I'll put into str or con if I can, but more likely chr.

Good to know, though.