Human Rights Abuses in China, No spamming por favor

Aragorn Returns · Post by **Aragorn Returns** » Thu Mar 07, 2002 10:05 pm

hey guys, i kinda need to write an essay about human rights abuses in china. i was kinda wondering if i could have a little help. it doesn't have to be a particularly good essay, my teacher is pretty lame. It only has to be 2 pages long and the format doesn't really matter. i know it's not that difficult but i really have better things to do. It's due tomorow. I'm on GMT -8, that's pacific time if you're from around here.
k, since there are a bunch of us we can really cut down the work.
assignments:
Curdis could write the opening paragraph? thanx a bunch, it also has to be tied in with how imperialsim created this problem, good luck.
allright, i'm gonna need 3 body paragraphs i think, so how about Fable, Viv and Abysmal do those, make sure the last one is all about imperialism.
and for closer how about you Ned.

allright guys, good luck! remember, it doesn't have to be perfect.

Aragorn Returns · Post by **Aragorn Returns** » Thu Mar 07, 2002 10:22 pm

not interested i see, hmm, well, i guess i'll have to do my own homework, grrr, that makes me mad.

Bloodstalker · Post by **Bloodstalker** » Thu Mar 07, 2002 10:38 pm

Well, I would have helped, but you didn't mention me and I felt slighted.

Aragorn Returns · Post by **Aragorn Returns** » Thu Mar 07, 2002 10:54 pm

allright, BS your assignment is to work on the whole essay, i know you're up to the challenge

Curdis · Post by **Curdis** » Thu Mar 07, 2002 10:59 pm

Originally posted by Aragorn Returns
i know it's not that difficult but i really have better things to do.

And I don't ?
O.K. Got Me.

Few countries have been given as much attention as China in recent times regarding Human Rights abuses. Whether this attention is in proportion to the scale of the problem in China is argueable given the many other serious human rights abuses occurring elsewhere. One of the things which makes China's record noteworthy may be the effect that colonial imperialism could have had on the moral philosophy of the Moaist revolutionaries. The post World War II long march and the subsequent 'gang of four' cultural revolution ruthlessly swept aside thousands of years of structured Confusion philosophy and tacitly subscribed to the position that the ends justified the means.

(there you go - remember that a good mark was the result of my contribution and a bad mark was the result of your editing. Also please thank the Australian Taxpayer). - Curdis !

Aragorn Returns · Post by **Aragorn Returns** » Thu Mar 07, 2002 11:07 pm

wow, thanx, i think i'll actually use that. just for the record, how much of that is complete BS?

Aragorn Returns · Post by **Aragorn Returns** » Fri Mar 08, 2002 12:39 am

hooray, i'm done with my essay, when i get my grade back i'll tell you what i got.

Curdis · Post by **Curdis** » Thu Mar 21, 2002 10:09 pm

What mark did I get?

If you want my help again... it might pay you to suck up a little bit. - Curdis !

Obsidian · Post by **Obsidian** » Thu Mar 21, 2002 10:24 pm

LOL
WOuld have been amusing for the teacher to have read 5 different writing styles in the course of one essay.

@AR, you'd let BS write ANYTHING for you? Ever!?

No offense BS

fable · Post by **fable** » Thu Mar 21, 2002 10:35 pm

You know, if this subject is going to reclaim a place on this first page, why don't we turn it into a real discussion about the issues surrounding human rights in China? The reasons for these abuses; the currying of favor by hypocritical European nations who want Chinese money; the problems that the Falon Gong, Tibetans, and political dissidents face in Chinese society.

Any takers?

C Elegans · Post by **C Elegans** » Thu Mar 21, 2002 10:36 pm

Originally posted by Aragorn Returns
wow, thanx, i think i'll actually use that. just for the record, how much of that is complete BS?

It's not BS at all

It's just a very brief introduction to the long story of China and how and why we look at China the way we do.

I agree, it would have been fun to see an essay composed by so many distinctly different writing styles

Perhaps I should turn to SYM to get some help with my articles

Hey, anyone feel like writing a journal article about central serotonin receptor systems, personality traits and cognition? I need about 3 articles on this subject

C Elegans · Post by **C Elegans** » Thu Mar 21, 2002 10:40 pm

Originally posted by fable
You know, if this subject is going to reclaim a place on this first page, why don't we turn it into a real discussion about the issues surrounding human rights in China? The reasons for these abuses; the currying of favor by hypocritical European nations who want Chinese money; the problems that the Falon Gong, Tibetans, and political dissidents face in Chinese society.

Any takers?

Certainly - the flat and hypocritic EU position towards China has annoyed me for a long time, it should annoy everybody that human rights abuses are more tolerated because of the value China has as a potential huge market.

On the other hand it also annoys me that I think we in the west have a deep lack of understanding and knowledge for the history and the situation in China.

Curdis · Post by **Curdis** » Thu Mar 21, 2002 11:02 pm

You want the TRUTH about China!!! You can't ....O.K. seriously I think this is a very interesting topic, but could I please amend the topic to 'China's place in regional and global affairs' The human rights issues are important but they need to be represented in context and I personally see the colonial influence as a distraction rather than a central issue.

To kick off; A bit of East-West influence/perspective with China: Marco Polo went to China looking for gold and came back with Noodles.

It would be interesting to hear from forum members who are regionally/culturally close to China. I have an excellent contact in Chinesse foriegn affairs(Australian) and can ask them questions if any come up. - Curdis !

fable · Post by **fable** » Thu Mar 21, 2002 11:14 pm

Originally posted by C Elegans

Certainly - the flat and hypocritic EU position towards China has annoyed me for a long time, it should annoy everybody that human rights abuses are more tolerated because of the value China has as a potential huge market.

On the other hand it also annoys me that I think we in the west have a deep lack of understanding and knowledge for the history and the situation in China.

I'd agree with both points. It never fails to amaze me that Western nations (this includes the US, of course) approach China with a very cavalier, reprimanding attitude, as if to say, "We, with our history of personal freedoms that are all of a hundred years old, insist that you eliminate elements of your national culture that were already in place before the Roman Empire became either Roman or an empire."

Quark · Post by **Quark** » Fri Mar 22, 2002 6:37 am

When China was established as part of the WTO I was disgusted. Not so much that they allowed a non-democratic country into the WTO, but the fact that China supresses their population with extreme prejudice.

Of course, if you look further, the WTO (which is becoming hated by many) has it's own problems with democracy too.

1) The commitee is not elected; it is appointed.
2) Debates and votes are held in secret.
3) After said votes, no one is held accountable for either side (good or bad).
4) Can anyone here even name a person in WTO?

For an organization that theoretically has the power to control economics in every country involved, it has suprising little accountability.

Curdis · Post by **Curdis** » Fri Mar 22, 2002 7:41 am

Originally posted by Quark
When China was established as part of the WTO I was disgusted.<snip>
For an organization that theoretically has the power to control economics in every country involved, it has suprising little accountability.

This has interesting resonances with a comment I made in 'Rogue State'. I don't want to be seen as a defender of China (in fact if this thread develops it may become apparent that I hold some pretty extreme views about the Chinese) but as fable pointed out above the standard western reaction to China is pretty condesending and fails to grasp the depths inherent in Chinese culture.

So they aren't democratic, big deal, if you are a US citizen your choice was Dubyah or 'The inventor of the internet' very democratic. The Chinese state certainly represses its population ruthlessly, and due to the size of the population this is ruthlessness on a pretty large scale. They aren't exactly alone in this sort of behaviour particularily in their local region. Remember Cambodia? The budhist attitude to the value of life is very interesting up close (in practice). I observed, in Thialand, that it seemed to be held that if you are coming back as something better (assumes you are closer to perfection) then why should you be concerned about leaving this world? It is actually a good thing to die.

While still notionally communist a capitalist China worries me much more. The ethnic Chinese through out the region are generally disliked in their resident nations because they are so sucessful at business. Whether this has to do with a better business or work ethic I don't know. It may be as simple as being better connected to venture capital.

So what I suppose I am steering towards here is that the Western fiscally motivated pragmatism towards the Chinese is actually pretty laughable when the Chinese practically personify fiscal pragmatism. Cynic that I am, I would suggest that the policians of the West need to start thumping the human rights tub in an effort to gain concessions from the Chinese in any economic dealings. The common view that China is a large and valuable market, while not without merit, is only part of the picture and doing business in China will inevitably mean playing by the Chinese rules. If some three piece in Boston/Paris/Cootamundra has figured out that China is a large and valuable market I'm pretty sure the Chinese might have realised it too. - Curdis !

Curdis · Post by **Curdis** » Wed Apr 03, 2002 6:48 pm

Originally posted by Aragorn Returns
hooray, i'm done with my essay, when i get my grade back i'll tell you what i got.

? - Curdis !