Computer Crash

Minerva · Post by **Minerva** » Sun Nov 18, 2001 5:28 pm

Today, my computer crashed twice, prevented by Crash Guard three times, and ended up restart 4 times.

I had a rather cr@ppy weekend, so this is the last thing I needed...

I haven't changed/added/moved anything at all(actually, I didn't use computer at all yesterday). In both crashes, my colour went odd: All orange/peach/brown type colours have gone and became grey (ie. folders). I'm using Win98, and haven't had much problem for 2 years. Though I had occasional freeze and crash, I believe that is not particularly special occurings.

What cause the crash, and what can I do to preventing from it?

KidD01 · Post by **KidD01** » Sun Nov 18, 2001 5:45 pm

Minerva, could you be more specific on what type of prog you're running, memory resident that is run on start up ?

I've bad experience with Norton CrashGuard, I highly recommend not to use it. it always makes my PC crash more than preventing it

Minerva · Post by **Minerva** » Sun Nov 18, 2001 5:57 pm

@Kid: Okay, my computer is Celeron 400 with 96Mb memory on it. Both graphics and sounds are on motherboard. (It's two years old, and I'm planning to change the lot at the moment.)

First, I tried to run Alpha Centauri (as I said, I'm having a cra@ppy weekend

) then it crashed, even before it even began loading. I restarted the computer and began the game successfully, and it crashed again about 15 minutes into the game. Restart again.

I've never had a problem with the game on this computer, and only change I ever made is to add another hard drive.

The CrashGuard prevented from two more crashes while I ran DiskDoctor/WinDoctor/SystemCheck (I can't remember which, but I ran them all after the two crashes in 30 minutes). I think CG nearly caused another crash.

I'm not happy.

KidD01 · Post by **KidD01** » Sun Nov 18, 2001 6:10 pm

Hmmm.....OK here's what I used to do :
1. Disable Norton Crash Guard using MSConfig.exe - It ca ne found on directory : Windows/System. I think It's on the startup option, just uncheck it. Restart your PC.
2. Run Norton System check, and fix all the probs detected by System Check.
3. Run Norton Optimasion wizard and give OK if the prog want to move your Swap file into first sector or space. This is to prevent your Win98 making too big swap file every time it runs a prog, which making the slowdown performance. (I add this to make the prog execution faster on every PC I handle)
4. Usually Norton Speedisk always runs automatically after the optimasion wizard. Let it be. It's beter to defrag all your HDD. I think Speedisk after opti wizard only defrag your system HDD. If you have another runs Speedisk and defrag other HDD.
5. Restart your PC and try to run Alpha Centaury again. See what happens.

Well that's all the regular things I use to do after a PC crash. Hope it helps.

[ 11-18-2001: Message edited by: KidD01 ]

Minerva · Post by **Minerva** » Sun Nov 18, 2001 6:19 pm

Thanks, Kid.

I'll try it tomorrow, because it's 1.20am and I don't really want to spend a few hours in front of my PC playing Alpha Centauri.

... Or fixing more problems...

KidD01 · Post by **KidD01** » Sun Nov 18, 2001 6:29 pm

LOL, NP Kawaii-chan

A final thoughts :
1. Before running Speedisk, try delete all temporary file --> files with tmp extension. it's useless anyway. (this procedure just to make more space on the HDD)
2. Crash Guard might sounds a cools prog but since Microsh!t owns the source code of windows, Norton sometimes make some error. Also CG seems too careful when it's active IMHO.
3. Never enable CG option when U installed Norton Utilities prog. It'll make your day worse than Dirty Harry does

Minerva · Post by **Minerva** » Mon Nov 19, 2001 4:57 am

UPDATE

I have removed CrashGuard as Kid (and Mr Sleep in other thread) mentioned.... I mean, I uninstall it.

Restart. Then, I ran Norton System Check, and repaired a few things. No problem.

After that, I ran Optimisation Wizard, and restarted my computer. A few seconds after the Windows screen, it went blue (like you get when you press Alt+Ctrl+Del) and got following message:

Terminating thread due to a stack overflow problem. A VxD, possibly installed recently, has consumed too much stack space. Increase the setting of 'MinSPs' in SYSTEM.INI or remove recently installed VxD's. There are currently 7 SPs allocated.

?????????

My computer seems running fine at the moment, but what is that? I have no idea what's that mean...

[ 11-19-2001: Message edited by: Minerva ]

Xandax · Post by **Xandax** » Mon Nov 19, 2001 5:02 am

If this dosen't happen agian, don't worry about it, if it does:

From Symantech:

Situation:
When using Norton AntiVirus (NAV), you see the error message "Terminating thread due to a stack overflow problem. A VxD, possibly recently installed, has consumed too much stack space. Increase the setting of 'MinSPs' in the SYSTEM.INI or remove recently installed VxDs."

Solution:
This is usually caused by a Windows setting that is set too low. What you need to do depends on your version of NAV.

NAV 2001
If you are using NAV 2001, this has been fixed by a program update. Please close all programs, run LiveUpdate, and select the Norton AntiVirus program update. You must restart the computer after the update is installed.

All other versions
To resolve this problem, you must make some modifications to the Config.sys and System.ini files, as follows:

1. Click Start, and then click Run. The Run dialog box appears.
2. Type sysedit and then press Enter. The System Configuration Editor opens.
3. Click the C:\Config.sys window.
4. Add or modify the following entries so that they are set to at least the following values:

FILES=150 (set to 200 if on a network)
BUFFERS=80
STACKS=12,256

5. Click the C:\Windows\System.ini window.
6. Add or modify the following entry in the [386Enh] section so that it is set to at least the following value:

MinSPs=4

NOTE: The MinSPs setting can be set higher if desired, but should be set in increments of 4. Each SP takes 4 KB of memory. (If there is no MinSPs statement, then the default value is set to 2.) For additional information on the MinSPs=4 setting, see the Microsoft Knowledge Base article There Are No Spare Stack Pages (ID Q149083).

7. (Windows 95 only). Add or modify the following entry in the [386Enh] section so that it is set to at least the following value:

MaxBPS=768

8. Save the changes, close the System Configuration Editor, and then restart the computer for the changes to take effect.

Minerva · Post by **Minerva** » Mon Nov 19, 2001 5:09 am

Thanks, Xandax.

It makes me think the time of "Dos+Win 3.11" was simpler and easier to deal with...

Xandax · Post by **Xandax** » Mon Nov 19, 2001 9:54 am

Originally posted by Minerva:
Thanks, Xandax.

It makes me think the time of "Dos+Win 3.11" was simpler and easier to deal with...

Well - yeah, but try to multitask with DOS

Minerva · Post by **Minerva** » Tue Nov 20, 2001 4:58 am

UPDATE: Minerva's computer problem is getting worse!!

Now I cannot start Windows at all!!

I have sorted out the CrashGuard, changed the Config.sys etc. It ran smoothly. I used Norton system check and disk doctor, and found no problem. I was happy then.

I then ran optimzation. Restart. Windows' opening screen showed up, followed by the messages:

A fatal exception 0E has occured at 0028:00000001. The current application will be terminated.

And,

0D at 0246:015F47FB

0D at 04AF:015F268B

Or,

0D at 0520:015F268B

Alt+Ctrl+Del showed the Explorer is not responding, but if I tell it to end the task, all icons and task bar disappears. Just blank screen.

I used the Emergency disks (both Windows and Norton Disk Doctor), and fixed the problem which appeared while running them. Yet, I still have the same message and cannot start (Bizzarly, I can use mouse in the Windows, but whole screen is just frozen).

As I can start from Safe Mode, I thought of running FDISK and reinstall Windows (I don't mind a few hours of reinstallation process), after saving necessary files. But I cannot use my CD-RW from the Safe Mode for some reason. I don't want to spend hours to save files onto dozens of floppy disks, if I can.

HELP!!!!

PS. I'm posting from a computer in my research centre...

Xandax · Post by **Xandax** » Tue Nov 20, 2001 6:54 am

Well well well.....
The fatal error can (depending on "module"/file) be anything from drivers to hardware failur.

My advice is reformating your hard-drive.

Or if you are brave, enter safe-mode, and start deleting programs, drivers etc. backtracking your way through your system, but the way you descripe it, it seems like a windows error.

The reason you most likely can't use your CD-RW from safemode, is because it dosen't load your drivers.

If you have a boot-disk, try that one, and see if you can access your CD-drive that way around.

(BTW - the error-code doesn't give a filename? - ei. Kernl386.exe or something?)

Hope this helps somewhat, it is hard for me to help, when not having my hands on the computer

[ 11-20-2001: Message edited by: Xandax ]

Minerva · Post by **Minerva** » Tue Nov 20, 2001 7:22 am

Originally posted by Xandax:
Well well well.....
The fatal error can (depending on "module"/file) be anything from drivers to hardware failur.

I suspected so...

My advice is reformating your hard-drive.

And, that's what I though I should do. Apart from obvious (like my thesis and saved games), what else do I need to save before doing it? Particularly, for system and Windows.

I have all original CD-ROMs and disks (being a good computer user

). Still, it's always worrying to reformat the hard drive.

Or if you are brave, enter safe-mode, and start deleting programs, drivers etc. backtracking your way through your system, but the way you descripe it, it seems like a windows error.

After the 24 hours struggle (literally, as I ran Disk Doctor all night. Woke up twice to check it, because it's in my bedroom.

), I really don't want to spend next 24 hours dealing with it, so I'll reformat.

The reason you most likely can't use your CD-RW from safemode, is because it dosen't load your drivers.

If you have a boot-disk, try that one, and see if you can access your CD-drive that way around.

Do you mean the boot-disk of Windows? I have that. Oh, I remember it mentioned something about CD-ROM driver...

(BTW - the error-code doesn't give a filename? - ei. Kernl386.exe or something?)

Nope. It only came up with loads of numbers and alphabets...

Does Microsoft expect us to understand that?

I can't even imagine what type of files/programmes they are, like .exe or .sys ...

Hope this helps somewhat, it is hard for me to help, when not having my hands on the computer

Thank you for the advice anyway.

I know the SYM is the fastest place to get advice.

I really wish Buck will create a forum for computer system, hardware and windows etc. So, I can bombard the place with all my computer troubles...

Yshania · Post by **Yshania** » Tue Nov 20, 2001 9:10 am

@Minerva - I donot remember - but does Win 98 offer you the chance to run System Restore? This will restore your system settings to an earlier (chosen) date.

Each day your registry and system settings are backed up - running Sys Restore could take you back to before your problems started - and is reversable if problematic...

Minerva · Post by **Minerva** » Tue Nov 20, 2001 9:18 am

Originally posted by Yshania:
@Minerva - I donot remember - but does Win 98 offer you the chance to run System Restore? This will restore your system settings to an earlier (chosen) date.

Each day your registry and system settings are backed up - running Sys Restore could take you back to before your problems started - and is reversable if problematic...

Mmm, there must be something for these situation, but I really can't remember. I cannot post from my home at the moment, unless I can connect in the Safe Mode.

I'll check it once I get back to home. Thanks.

Xandax · Post by **Xandax** » Tue Nov 20, 2001 9:42 am

Originally posted by Minerva:
I have all original CD-ROMs and disks (being a good computer user ). Still, it's always worrying to reformat the hard drive.

Well you're certainly a better user than me - no backup, no sys.disks etc.
(real men don't backup - real men cry a lot

)

Originally posted by Minerva:

Does Microsoft expect us to understand that? I can't even imagine what type of files/programmes they are, like .exe or .sys ...

Nope they are error messages for the programmers. Adresses in the files, modules. (hex-numbers) useally they deliver a filename also - unless it is sever windows problems

Originally posted by Yshania:

@Minerva - I donot remember - but does Win 98 offer you the chance to run System Restore? This will restore your system settings to an earlier (chosen) date.
Each day your registry and system settings are backed up - running Sys Restore could take you back to before your problems started - and is reversable if problematic...

Nope - IIRC it was a WinME and later feature.
But be very careful with such a restore, becasue if a virus gets into your system (for example) and doesn't start creating havoc soon, it will be backed up together with the rest of your system

Yshania · Post by **Yshania** » Tue Nov 20, 2001 9:48 am

@Minrva in Win ME Sys Restore can be found in System Tools/System Informaion in the 'Tools' drop down menu.

It will take your system back to a more stable point in time...you choose the date, I believe it keeps information for three weeks or so...

You will not lose any data files - but may have to install one or two programmes

Posted by Xan -

Well you're certainly a better user than me - no backup, no sys.disks etc.
(real men don't backup - real men cry a lot )

LMAO!

Posted by Xan -

Nope - IIRC it was a WinME and later feature.
But be very careful with such a restore, becasue if a virus gets into your system (for example) and doesn't start creating havoc soon, it will be backed up together with the rest of your system

Hmmm...but it will be backed up anyway won't it? The Reg automatically backs up...

Well - Sys Restore worked for me - as a last resort...

Bloodstalker · Post by **Bloodstalker** » Tue Nov 20, 2001 9:53 am

Well, I don't know 98 that good, being as I work with NT all day, but I don't believe you can fix this problem any other way excapt to format and do a clean install.

I know the restore option is availabe for Me and XP, but I don't think you can do anything with 98 registry in this situation, unless you are brave enough to actually go into the registry itself and poke around. Personally, I ain't

Minerva · Post by **Minerva** » Tue Nov 20, 2001 9:57 am

Thanks guys. I'm off to catch the last bus home, and try if I can do anything about my computer.

See you.

Yshania · Post by **Yshania** » Tue Nov 20, 2001 10:01 am

Laters, Minerva - good luck!