nov 17 and Afghanistan

CM · Post by CM » Fri Oct 26, 2001 8:06 am

I am a little reluctant about posting this, but here goes anyway.
Since this place is so diverse in representing the world over, i had a two questions on what you people think should happen after nov 17.

Now the first question is do any of you know the significance of nov 17 for this year.
If you do just say yes but don't give the answer, i just want to know how many people are aware of it.

Second for those who do know why Nov 17 is important do you think US air strikes should continue after this date.

Those who don't know, i will explain after say 10 people post saying they have no clue.

nael · Post by **nael** » Fri Oct 26, 2001 8:53 am

yes i know, and yes the attacks should continue....islamic countries have always kept fighting in the past

CM · Post by CM » Fri Oct 26, 2001 9:17 am

Even with the extremely high possibility that islamic countries will leave the coalition?

Vivien · Post by **Vivien** » Fri Oct 26, 2001 9:19 am

Fas, I do and don't know. I've heard, but don't think I fully understand. As I don't fully understand, I shouldn't give an opinion as to continuing fighting.

CM · Post by CM » Fri Oct 26, 2001 9:23 am

Ok so is that a yes or a no?
Or do you want a explanation?

Oh yeah nael you said that islamic countries have fought during the period.
Could you give some examples?

[ 10-26-2001: Message edited by: Fas ]

McBane · Post by **McBane** » Fri Oct 26, 2001 9:24 am

I think I know. And if I am right, we should not stop. Once you give out the correct answer, I will be happy to give my opinions on why we shouldnt.

CM · Post by CM » Fri Oct 26, 2001 9:25 am

ok so that is 2 no's and a 1 yes.

Happy Evil · Post by **Happy Evil** » Fri Oct 26, 2001 10:20 am

1.Maybe
2.Yes

Rob-hin · Post by **Rob-hin** » Fri Oct 26, 2001 10:37 am

Well, I am more or less up to date ablout the whole situation, but I suck at remembering dates, so I don't remember what happend then.
As for the attack, no more rockets, it's time for more precise uhrm...whatever they do.

scully1 · Post by **scully1** » Fri Oct 26, 2001 10:43 am

I don't know exactly what Nov. 17th signifies. I'm assuming it signals the start of some period of time, from the posts I've read so far? My opinion is that, no matter what that date signifies, military operations should not stop for the duration of that period. Perhaps for one day (i.e. the 17th itself); but an extended delay in operations would undo everything that has been done so far. From a strategical point of view, delay would be a huge mistake on the part of the US and its allies. The Taliban would take advantage of the delay in one of two ways: 1.) Use the "down time" to strategize, recoup their losses, and reinforce their own troops and munitions if possible. 2.) Plan a surprise attack if they thought their opponents were unprepared. Or a combination of both. In order to avoid these things, there must be no let-up. You don't leave you enemy alone for a while and give them time to think or grow stronger. You don't attack and then stop short and do nothing for a while. Sounds harsh, but that's war.

[ 10-26-2001: Message edited by: loner72 ]

Yshania · Post by **Yshania** » Fri Oct 26, 2001 10:56 am

1. Yes
2. Yes - but not for this reason alone.

nael · Post by **nael** » Fri Oct 26, 2001 11:31 am

the war between iraq and iran never let up.

Xandax · Post by **Xandax** » Fri Oct 26, 2001 11:32 am

1) Am pretty sure
2) IMO - no.

Lazarus · Post by **Lazarus** » Fri Oct 26, 2001 11:35 am

I know what the date signifies.

Our campaign should continue, regardless.

CM · Post by CM » Fri Oct 26, 2001 1:08 pm

Ok i am not counting how many Nos.

Here is the explanation:
The 17th of Nov starts the Holy month of Ramadan for muslims.
We fast from before day break to after the sun sets.
That is around 12 hours a day depending where you live, it is 20 hours if you are in the Northern European Nations

Now according to islamic teachings, we should fight during this period.
However if attack we have the right to retaliate.
But the point now is not important.
It is one of those few moments where feelings of muslim "unity and brotherhood" at extremely high levels.

Looking at it from the political point of view, is that US actions during Ramadan WILL inflame common muslims on the street.
Something the US does not want to happen.
People in muslim nations are already pissed off with the US.
Attacking during a holy period to all muslims will not earn them any brownie points, which is half the war.

Just to provide some information which is not covered by the US media - so far that is.
[url="http://www.independent.co.uk/story.jsp?story=101536"]http://www.independent.co.uk/story.jsp?story=101536[/url]

Please don't take this - the article above - as a flame or insult.
I am just providing a different point of view and news not seen on CNN.

@nael correct to an extent.
For the first 4 years during the iraq iran war fighting was eliminated during the month of Ramadan.
However after that they did fight during Ramadan.
This i read - i own the book - in "Iran and Iraq - A account of the War"
The author is a pakistani.
I doubt you an get the book on amazon, but you are welcome to look for it.

ThorinOakensfield · Post by **ThorinOakensfield** » Fri Oct 26, 2001 1:48 pm

Ramadan- also pronounced Ramzan in Pakistan and India.

The US could cause the coalition to break up.
Ramzan is the most sacred month in the Muslim calendar, and it ends with Eid, the most important day/days in the whole year for Muslims.
I don't think the US should continue to attack Afghanistan.
And the Taliban, being "good" Muslims, will certainly continue to accuse the US of attacking Islam, with more reason, though.

THE JAKER · Post by **THE JAKER** » Fri Oct 26, 2001 1:58 pm

Originally posted by Fas:
<STRONG>Now according to islamic teachings, we should fight during this period.
However if attack we have the right to retaliate.
</STRONG>

I assume you meant "Should not".

CM · Post by CM » Fri Oct 26, 2001 2:04 pm

Originally posted by THE JAKER:
<STRONG>I assume you meant "Should not".</STRONG>

You are right.
My bad.

C Elegans · Post by **C Elegans** » Fri Oct 26, 2001 4:22 pm

I am surprised to see so many people not knowing the significance of Ramadan, since islam is one of the world religions! Not knowing the exact date is not so surprising since the date changes from year to year, but Fas question was rather "leading" and also, the question has been in the media a lot.

However, MPO:

Yes, I know about Ramadan.
Yes, the airstrikes should stop, but IMO they should have stopped already for other reasons.

@Fas: What happens to a muslim who lives above the Arctic circle when Ramadan is in the Northen hemisphere summer? There must be some kind of reasonable clock they can use instead of sunrise and sunset?

Yshania · Post by **Yshania** » Fri Oct 26, 2001 4:44 pm

Posted by Fas -

We fast from before day break to after the sun sets.
That is around 12 hours a day depending where you live, it is 20 hours if you are in the Northern European Nations

Unless I am mistaken there are modern day concessions to this rule though aren't there? For instance...pregnant women?