Hardcore

[Lady Dragonfly]

Would be cool to eliminate your boss using VATS, run away, come back in two days and no one remembers what you did (just like in F3) so everything goes as usual, minus boss.
I doubt it would be hardcore though, if they don't remember.

@Crenshinibon

I don't see why people say that ironman mode is masochistic. I mean for a game that you know like the back of your hand, such as the Baldur's Gate series, it's easy.

How would you defeat Kagnaxx (sp?) in ironman mode?

[GawainBS]

Use a protection from Magic scroll, or a Berserker?

[Crenshinibon]

That's exactly it. There's a recent thread in the Baldur's Gate forum that speaks of strategies when fighting against Kangaxx.

The bare minimum you need is:

Protection From Magic
Protection From Undead
Ring of the Ram
An elemental weapon.

That's about it. You can hack and slash the lich form for as long as you want after you cast Protection From Magic on him as without spells, ANY lich is harmless. After his transformation you'd want to cast Protection From Undead on yourself, use Ring of the Ram on him (which will clear more than half his health) and deal some twenty damage to him, which is what the elemental weapons are for.

[galraen]

What's the point of playing in ironman mode if you're going to exploit glitches and cheese, once you start doing that surely it's no longer ironman mode?

PS, maybe discussing types of cheese and what constitutes a glitch endlessly should also be factored in to being hardcore or not!

[GawainBS]

That's not cheese, that's playing D&D by the rules. Liche is undead, hence Protection from Undead.

[galraen]

Those scrolls are 100% cheese, with added gorgonzola and mozarella on top!

[Kipi]

Those scrolls are 100% cheese, with added gorgonzola and mozarella on top!

And what makes using scrolls cheese?

I still consider myself a semi-hardcore gamer tho. Hmm, maybe i should get a few words of advice from Kip, our resident hardcore RPGer (self-proclaimed), to increase my prestige level. What say u, oh wise master?

Heh, should I take this as good or bad thing?
But if you really want find master, perhaps you should turn towards Xandax. I think he's much more hardcore than me

But if you really want to tips from me, well, play those classic oldies again and again untill you know and remember them without checking any material. Next, you must play also new RPGs as well, so that you know where the current trend is going. If you don't do that, there is no possibility to get nostalgic. Third, even when you play new games as well, and even when it's definately acceptable to like them, be critic about them. Does those actually have content, or just super graphics?

And finally, do not hesitate to try older games you haven't tried already just because those don't have graphics and controls comparable to todays standards. Lots of new RPG gamers turns their backs to old classics because "Those have poor graphics, poor resolution and poor colours". IMO tsuch gamers can never become hardcore RPG gamers.

[GawainBS]

Those scrolls are 100% cheese, with added gorgonzola and mozarella on top!

I agree that it is an extremely easy way out, but it's not that you're exploiting a glitch or a bug. The scrolls were made available in the game with a specific purpose, so using them for that purpose isn't exactly cheese.

[galraen]

I agree that it is an extremely easy way out, but it's not that you're exploiting a glitch or a bug. The scrolls were made available in the game with a specific purpose, so using them for that purpose isn't exactly cheese.

Setting traps around dragons etc. when they are neutral is also made available in the game, does that make that exploit noy cheesy either?

I think we may both have moved a step closer to hardcore here!:laugh:

[GawainBS]

Setting traps around dragons etc. when they are neutral is also made available in the game, does that make that exploit noy cheesy either?

I think we may both have moved a step closer to hardcore here!:laugh:

I can see the difference, though: the Dragon would probably wonder what you're putting around him. (And probably be more than intelligent enough to counter it.)
But the scrolls of Undead Protection solely exist for protecting yourself from Undead. They were designed to be put to that use. What's the exploit here? It's the same as casting Protection from Fire before attacking an enemy that can only use fire. Cheap, yes, but you're using the resources as they were intended.

[Crenshinibon]

Well, no one's really saying anything about bugs. As GawainBS said, these scrolls have a specific function and I suppose you would have to appreciate it because a lot of people have been ripping their hair out when fighting Kangaxx for a few years now. It's interesting how nobody bothered to use a scroll that have such a clear purpose.

As for traps, I do believe that they are cheesy and cheap, so I stopped putting points in the Set Traps skill.

By knowing the game by heart you can start preparing for the hard fights early on, that's the real edge you have.

[galraen]

Set traps also has a specific function, and Bioware could have revised their usage in any patch. A Lich is supposed to be a genius, so you'd expect them to cast dispel magic at the start of any combat, which would result in the automatic dispelling of any scroll or potion effect.

[GawainBS]

Set traps also has a specific function, and Bioware could have revised their usage in any patch. A Lich is supposed to be a genius, so you'd expect them to cast dispel magic at the start of any combat, which would result in the automatic dispelling of any scroll or potion effect.

This takes it too far off topic, but the scroll protects you from Undead, which might include Dispel casted by one.
Look, I'll give it that it is a cheap tactic, but it's no exploit.

[Loki[D.d.G]]

Heh, should I take this as good or bad thing?

Take it as a good thing. Its called R-E-S-P-E-C-T.

But if you really want to tips from me, well, play those classic oldies again and again untill you know and remember them without checking any material.

I pretty much devote plenty of attention to RPGs that i consider worthy of my time. So much so, that i could prolly recall its material after a single play through. Still, wat fun is a RPG with replays? Just to induce a homicidal rampage on the people you've just saved on the 1st play thru.

Lots of new RPG gamers turns their backs to old classics because "Those have poor graphics, poor resolution and poor colours". IMO tsuch gamers can never become hardcore RPG gamers.

I've never been one to care for graphics. Sure, pretty images can make a game somewhat more enjoyable, but in the end, it's always the content and gameplay that counts for me.

[Lady Dragonfly]

Talking about exploits...
Don't you think "knowing the game by heart" and being able to come 100% prepared every time can be considered an exploit? Also, where is the fun? Where is the sense of achievement?

[Crenshinibon]

Personally I think that you can't do anything about knowing the game by heart and whether you want to admit it or not, you will know what to expect. Sure, you don't have to prepare ahead of time, but then again, at that point, you probably know how to do so on the spot with utmost efficiency.

I think it's an achievement to know the game so well. Many of our members have fun playing a game like Baldur's Gate and still find new things about it. I started playing the series back in 1998 and I still play the game almost religiously with pure enjoyment and satisfaction.

[Ode to a Grasshopper]

Alright...I'm definitely not hardcore.

What's VATS again?

Oh, and I'd quite like to see a poll on the Protection from Magic/Undead scrolls cheese/not-cheese issue - IIRC I always just upped magic resistance heaps on a target PC (usually Anomen), heaped nasty spells on him/sent in the heavy hitters and hoped for the best (and as a result barely survived with frequent reloading).
Must play multi sometime where proper spellcasters can do their thing while I stand back and peg arrows at everything as is my wont - where're my SLURR crew when I need 'em?

[Beldin]

Well - I don't think I qualify as "hardcore".

Points 1, 4, 5 and 6 ist hjust not enought, I think.

But I returned to playing BG and BGII for the umpteenth time since my first go all those years ago... It seems like I just can't get these games out of my system...

- where're my SLURR crew when I need 'em?

...closer than you think, mate. Closer than you think...:speech:

[Kipi]

I think it's an achievement to know the game so well. Many of our members have fun playing a game like Baldur's Gate and still find new things about it. I started playing the series back in 1998 and I still play the game almost religiously with pure enjoyment and satisfaction.

Especially if the game is complex enough, like BGs, Fallouts (Yeah, I count F3 to this category as well), Planescape and so on. But usually you just can't learn to remember 100% of them, as there is just so much details in those games. For example, I can say that I know Fallout 2 quite well, and most of the time I can help people without checking the game or walkthroughs. Still, there are situations where I find something I hadn't known before or just plain forgotten.

What's VATS again?

Bethesda's version of turns and AP system in Fallout 3

[Lady Dragonfly]

V.A.T.S. - Fallout Wiki - The Vault.

V.A.T.S. is first introduced to the player character on their 10th birthday in Vault 101 upon receiving a BB Gun.

Hardcore 10-yrs-olds, Bethesda's target audience, lol