Opinions on KotOR II (spoilers)

walterd140 · Post by **walterd140** » Tue Dec 13, 2005 10:13 pm

[QUOTE=Alcina]What I find really badly thought out is that it is perfectly possible to play the game without ever finding out what the plot is!QUOTE]

You hit the nail right on the head there Alcina. It's like walking into the middle of a B-flick movie with no popcorn

Furthermore, you can add to the confusion by doing what you think is good, only to find you did something bad (i.e. 2nd bum on Na Shadarr)

Walter

Xandax · Post by **Xandax** » Wed Dec 14, 2005 12:52 am

[QUOTE=Alcina]What I find really badly thought out is that it is perfectly possible to play the game without ever finding out what the plot is! First time through I didn't realise the importance of talking to my companions, and had no idea what was going on at all. The problem was made even worse by my being DS first time through, and thus not getting the Jedi Council scene etc.<snip>[/quote]

Actually that is some of the things I find good about this game.
It is a roleplaying game after all, which means that it should fall upon the player to do some of the "work" as well, as compared to simply getting the story and plot served to him on a silver platter - like in most other modern games. The story in kotor2 was good - much better and much more complex then the first one which was straight forward with no real suprises.
It requiers immersion into the game to figure out what goes on, which is excatly one of the traits a roleplaying game should have. (However, the game is still only a RPG-Lite in my view

)

[QUOTE=walterd140]<snip>Furthermore, you can add to the confusion by doing what you think is good, only to find you did something bad (i.e. 2nd bum on Na Shadarr)
<snip>[/QUOTE]

This situation was one I liked about this game. I thought it was well-thought out and again - added some complexity to the game. The developers could (should in my view) have done more of such, instead of a few sporadic situations. Even the world in the Star Wars universe can be complex at times, where everything isn't black and white. Such situation as this one are used to present the greyer scale of life.

Hill-Shatar · Post by **Hill-Shatar** » Wed Dec 14, 2005 5:38 pm

[QUOTE=Xandax]This situation was one I liked about this game. I thought it was well-thought out and again - added some complexity to the game. The developers could (should in my view) have done more of such, instead of a few sporadic situations. Even the world in the Star Wars universe can be complex at times, where everything isn't black and white. Such situation as this one are used to present the greyer scale of life.[/QUOTE]

I quite agree with one statement. The line of grey is barely portrayed in any game, so it was nice to learn that actions are not truly black and white. The fight between the two merchants was also helpful... either you force off the one merchant for better items earlier, or you push off the other for much better items later, and neither side, in my opinion, seemed to be DS or LS.

I liked being able to play a game when you really have to think about the effects of your actions, from all points of view. Sometimes, doing good deeds for an hour to make it possible to heal yourself consecutively ten times is really boring... having options that will unintentionally lose you alignment points also appealed to me.

Another thing, influence, also forced you to walk the fine line between losing alignment points or losing influence points, and also making sure that your actions are approved by those around you, or will make some gain. I am quite proud to say I never lost any influence with Kreia, nor did I lose and alignment points with her, but instead played the verbal tango until I could get the conversation to a point I wanted where both alignment and influence had a great chance to increase. Also, there were some DS options that Kreai found dispaicable (one was in the sacrifice for others where you can decide to call her expendable... and the other one was far DS, and I do believe she says "You have learned nothing" if you choose it). It added a layer of thought and interest that you rarely get anymore (even if the puzzles were a little on the low side...

)

Thran Baill · Post by **Thran Baill** » Thu Dec 15, 2005 1:45 pm

[QUOTE=Hill-Shatar]
Another thing, influence, also forced you to walk the fine line between losing alignment points or losing influence points, and also making sure that your actions are approved by those around you, or will make some gain.[/QUOTE]

I couldn't agree more. I found playing the DS for the first time extremely challenging in this matter. In fact, I was only able to turn one person (atton) over to the DS, while keeping my DS alignment where I wanted it. As a lightside player, I found this to be far more of an easy balancing act to do. I think as a DS player the interactions with your party need to be different, or give you different NPC's based on your alignment.

Alien_Newborn · Post by **Alien_Newborn** » Thu Dec 15, 2005 7:28 pm

One thing I found annoying about KOTOR 2, was that high influence changed nothing but allignment, except Mira, who in my DS game seemed to develop a split personality (and was, like, asking herself questions and stuff: creepy)

Other than that, however, I thought this game was alot better than the original becuase it was a bit less predictable than the original, in which I was all like (during Malak's "you still haven't realized it yet?" speech) "Let me guess, I'M Darth Revan?". I thought the plot was cool becuase it was alot like Dune, where things get left unanswered until the end, which kinda makes you want to play (or read, as it were) more. I thought the game had alot more substance to it, more freedom, more influence on your allies, and more amusing darkside moments (eg. "Please don't kill me! I'm only doing my job!" and I said "Well, you should have picked a safer line of work then." )

The Reaper · Post by **The Reaper** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 5:59 am

Yes, I did enjoy KOTOR II alot better than KOTOR I.

I hadn't thought of it yet until you mentioned it Alien_Newborn but yes, I think if the characters/compainions move further to the light or dark, their attitude should change. It makes sense, and yet they didn't... It would have made the game a whole lot better and more realistic. I mean, who has ever met a person consumed by the Dark Side of the Force that was polite and calm???

REal953 · Post by **REal953** » Sun Dec 18, 2005 6:19 pm

i agree (spoiler)

[QUOTE=walterd140]Don't get me wrong. I did enjoy the plot twists as well. Just seemed a bit hollow and rushed. Seemed we could of had 1 more planet to explore all the loose ends before the finale[/QUOTE]

When i was playing i felt the same way. it was kind of mad that when you retured to telos the end had started.

Hill-Shatar · Post by **Hill-Shatar** » Sun Dec 18, 2005 6:25 pm

[QUOTE=The Reaper]
Yes, I did enjoy KOTOR II alot better than KOTOR I.

I hadn't thought of it yet until you mentioned it Alien_Newborn but yes, I think if the characters/compainions move further to the light or dark, their attitude should change. It makes sense, and yet they didn't... It would have made the game a whole lot better and more realistic. I mean, who has ever met a person consumed by the Dark Side of the Force that was polite and calm???
[/QUOTE]

I am quite sure that those are open qualities to both sides.

It would have been nice if the characters were developed a bit more. How often is it that you can find out something about a character so quickly? The first one was a little more interesting in this case, the second on had very little to go on. Probably with the adition of the influence system. Before, you had to actually pry it out of them, in this one, they just said the same thing over and over again until you got a certain level of influence with them, then they spilled it all out and you just had to get more influence to get more. That did not overly impress me.

Vic20 · Post by **Vic20** » Mon Dec 19, 2005 10:31 am

It's too bad when they rush out games like this, in my opinion developing a game should take the time it takes, even if its several years, when i first played Kotor II i really had problem understadin the end, it takes alot of thought to understand, it almost seems that the last pieces of the puzzle disapered and now one is forced to but the wrong pieces toghether to make it work

Sudarium · Post by **Sudarium** » Fri Dec 23, 2005 8:50 pm

Question 1: Did anyone else feel bad for Kriea (or however you spell her name) in the end?
Goodness, no. Kreia's a wench. She served no purpose but to annoy me throughout the game. "Use your partners, they're just fodder anyway" was all that came out of her mouth. I understand that that is "in character" for her, but its sheer perpetuation drove me nuts.

Question 2: Did anyone else feel cheated with not being able to hook back up with the members of your team to come to some sort of conclusion with them ... perhaps being able to see the changes that you had brought about? Regardless of the the things that Kriea had to say?
Yes. The conclusion was really anti-climatic. It made me sad to see it so poorly thought-out. I wanted to at least have a cutscene with my companions or something.

Statement 1: It seems obvious to me that the game makers left it so that there can be a sequel.
But of course. All things in Star Wars are done in trilogies

.

Statement 2: I wish the creators would have worked out more of the bugs (even though I had set up the fuel trade for Telos, that never happened, even though the Hut confirmed it when I went back to him, but when I went to Telos to speak with the general, no such thing was taking place... and yes, I went back when I was supposed to).
The game was definitely rushed.

Statement 3: Way too many loose ends. Instead of feeling like I was left hanging for the next game, I felt a bit cheated.
Like I said before, it lacked a real conclusion. The thing that bothered me the most was how you couldn't really do character quests. In the first KotOR, you would have a sidequest for your companions to learn more about them and things like that. I was addicted to those, personally. The romance sidequests in KotOR I were existent, unlike KotOR II, which I find silly. If too many people complained about them, they didn't have to take part in them, so why cut it out of the second one? You can see romantic tension, but it doesn't really go anywhere. That kinda annoyed me.

Statement 4: (feeling a bit like HK-47 here) I still enjoyed the game. Which takes me to my last question.
Any game you can slice up bad guys with a lightsaber is a good one.

Question 3: Any recomendations for another role playing game? I have played: Morrowind, Fable, KOTOR1, and of course, this one, any suggestions?
Pick a Final Fantasy, any Final Fantasy. None of those have a rushed plot, that's for sure. The plot in FFVII is one of the best ever.

If you need one that's for PC, Final Fantasy IX is the only one that comes to mind. (That one's addicting ^_^).

The Reaper · Post by **The Reaper** » Fri Dec 30, 2005 6:28 am

These are my answers to Sudarium's questions:

QUESTION 1: I felt no remorse what-so-ever for Kriea. I think she deserved what she got in the end. She was way to dangerous to keep alive anyway.

QUESTION 2: I also didn't like how I could have one final word with my fellow companions. I crashed on Malachore V, just after the huge battle on the Ravanger to find I could not enter the Ebon Hawk after that. Which really annoyed me... Once the game was finished I didn't feel like I finished it completely.

STATEMENT 2: I think if there was a little more time spent on the game, it would have been done for the better. That and many loose ends can and would be tied up, leaving no un-answered questions.

Orfinn · Post by **Orfinn** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 4:56 am

Question 1: Did anyone else feel bad for Kriea (or however you spell her name) in the end?
Im actually a bit split here, she was a well manupilating witch, she was actually neither good or bad in the beginning(well she was a nice old lady in the start but got worse the more i understood what she was planning) but when I began to sense some creepy about her I wished there could be an option in a conversation (for all party members) that you didnt want her along anymore (you shouldnt get any light or bad points for that) In the end I got satisfied by killed that wrech, man she was a plague!

Question 2: Did anyone else feel cheated with not being able to hook back up with the members of your team to come to some sort of conclusion with them ... perhaps being able to see the changes that you had brought about? Regardless of the the things that Kriea had to say?

Same statement here, it felt empty at the end, i hoped as many here to see my companions one last time and get a real conclusion, a real end.

Statement 1: It seems obvious to me that the game makers left it so that there can be a sequel.

Ofcourse cliffhangers are top notch for producers good idea to make money on sequels.

Statement 2: I wish the creators would have worked out more of the bugs (even though I had set up the fuel trade for Telos, that never happened, even though the Hut confirmed it when I went back to him, but when I went to Telos to speak with the general, no such thing was taking place... and yes, I went back when I was supposed to).

I know it was weird he didnt talked about anything regarding the fuel he got from Vagga.

Statement 3: Way too many loose ends. Instead of feeling like I was left hanging for the next game, I felt a bit cheated.

No kiddin? Same her I hate producers choosing profit over the fans wishes for a great game, they ruin themself great games sells more in the lenght. Bad, rushed games for fast money especially thanks to the christmas season give me a bad taste for trusting the developers.

Statement 4: (feeling a bit like HK-47 here) I still enjoyed the game. Which takes me to my last question.

Question 3: Any recomendations for another role playing game? I have played: Morrowind, Fable, KOTOR1, and of course, this one, any suggestions?

If you like sci-fi horror, I suggest find a copy of System Shock 2, a scary game and a mix of FPS and RPG it deserved more reputation than it got.