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Originally posted by Silur:
<STRONG><snip>
A quick question regarding viruses - would you feel safer if your ISP were to filter your mail for viruses before delivery? If so, would you want the file (or whatever) delivered with a *huge* warning or just deleted with a notification?</STRONG>

I would not want that - I can take care of my own emails

@Weasel: Really strange symptoms. At a quick glance, I couldn't find anything that matches. Have a look [url="http://www.viruslist.com/eng/viruslist.asp"]here[/url] to browse through some of the currently known malware.

There's a free DOS version of fsecure's virusscanner that I think is pretty good (and it's free ). It still checks for all windows-based viruses, macroviruses, etc and cleans them out exactly like the the Windows GUI version. It's available somewhere at [url="http://www.fsecure.com"]Fsecure's[/url] site.

Originally posted by Silur:
<STRONG>A quick question regarding viruses - would you feel safer if your ISP were to filter your mail for viruses before delivery? If so, would you want the file (or whatever) delivered with a *huge* warning or just deleted with a notification?</STRONG>

I don't want, nor need, that. I rarely check my email and when I do, I ignore at least half the emails.

Originally posted by Xandax:
<STRONG>I would not want that - I can take care of my own emails </STRONG>

I take it you're not running Outlook . I think the problems are that 1) The ISP won't guarantee anything, and 2) people will lean back feeling secure. Advantages are that you'd limit the scope (spread) of a virus quicker and you would somewhat limit the number of infections for those not currently taking apropriate measures.

Originally posted by Sailor Saturn:
<STRONG>I don't want, nor need, that. I rarely check my email and when I do, I ignore at least half the emails. </STRONG>

The day ISP's can filter mails for relevance, I'll be happy. Drop everything that isn't interesting or important The manual filter that does this today tends to work up stress and aggression, which in the long run isn't good for it's health...

I used to be on a server that scanned for viruses, if it found one it deleted it and sent a mail to both parties saying that the mail was infected, the only problem was that it required one to have a firm grasp of what the process was, quite often a customer would think we had infected them with a virus even though it was the other way around purely because the way the warning was sent.

Originally posted by Silur:
<STRONG>I take it you're not running Outlook <snip>
</STRONG>

Well actually - that is what I'm running

Originally posted by Mr Sleep:
<STRONG>I used to be on a server that scanned for viruses, if it found one it deleted it and sent a mail to both parties saying that the mail was infected, the only problem was that it required one to have a firm grasp of what the process was, quite often a customer would think we had infected them with a virus even though it was the other way around purely because the way the warning was sent. </STRONG>

I know that many corporate mailservers are configured that way. The ISP's have been reluctant, since it does require quite a few extra I/O and CPU cycles for each mail. If an ISP were to implement such a feature, they would never send a notification back to the sender, because of the obvious DoS (denial of service) implications. Every system in existence where you can send x data and amplify it to 2*x data have been used to wreck havoc on the net.

Originally posted by Xandax:
<STRONG>Well actually - that is what I'm running </STRONG>

Man, you are brave M$ have taken "active payload" a bit too far... even javascript in the subject line gets executed. I get really suspicious of programs that run scriptcode automatically (even before the mail is opened, mind you) without asking me first.

[ 10-17-2001: Message edited by: Silur ]

Originally posted by Silur:
<STRONG>Every system in existence where you can send x data and amplify it to 2*x data have been used to wreck havoc on the net.</STRONG>

and we wouldn't want that To be honest the web is mostly in a shambles anyway, every server experiences hacks or downtime.

The problem is one has to account for the uneducated user, the user who doesn't know how a virus propogates, not least the resources to remove taht virus, my company has clients that is has taken about 2 years to train not to open the email then ring us and ask why there machine is doing 'strange' things. They ring us first, then we make the decision.

Another major problem is that in companies enmployees can quite often not differentiate a work machine with a home one, so they are accepting all manner of jokes and unecessary files into their mail boxes without accounting for the 1000's that could be lost if they get infected with a virus.

Originally posted by Silur:
<STRONG>Man, you are brave M$ have taken "active payload" a bit too far... even javascript in the subject line gets executed. I get really suspicious of programs that run scriptcode automatically (even before the mail is opened, mind you) without asking me first.

[ 10-17-2001: Message edited by: Silur ]</STRONG>

One can click on the propertes of that mail, go to message source and then read the body of that email, that way it is not able to run the VB code necessary to infect your machine. Also one should always remove the preview pane, that way the email is not automatically opened when one clicks on it

Originally posted by Mr Sleep:
<STRONG>and we wouldn't want that To be honest the web is mostly in a shambles anyway, every server experiences hacks or downtime.</STRONG>

All my downtime these last few years have been because of disk failure Haven't been hacked once, although a system I was partly responsible for got hacked 4 years ago because some brilliant user exported a disk world writeable...

<STRONG>The problem is one has to account for the uneducated user, the user who doesn't know how a virus propogates, not least the resources to remove taht virus, my company has clients that is has taken about 2 years to train not to open the email then ring us and ask why there machine is doing 'strange' things. They ring us first, then we make the decision. </STRONG>

My current client has gone all emotional in the decisionmaking layer, and decided to replace all M$-based systems with u*ix. Not that I mind, being a u*ix devotee, but I really hate it when decisions aren't based on facts - it usually backfires in the long run. Personally, I'm pragmatic (read old ) enough to realize that you can't entirely eradicate M$ from your computing environment (yet... )

<STRONG>Another major problem is that in companies enmployees can quite often not differentiate a work machine with a home one, so they are accepting all manner of jokes and unecessary files into their mail boxes without accounting for the 1000's that could be lost if they get infected with a virus.</STRONG>

Well, Sircam and Nimda pretty much blew "don't open suspicious emails" out of the water as a protection mechanism... I'm voting for the return of textbased, non-executable, non-mime-multipart-multimedia-enhanced mail with ascii art and non-graphic-enhanced smilies 8-\.

Speaking of work, maybe I'd better go there... _very_ quickly! Spamming is dangerous, losing track of time... and space. Or, as they said in the bad, old days, L8r

Originally posted by Silur:
<STRONG>Man, you are brave M$ have taken "active payload" a bit too far... even javascript in the subject line gets executed. I get really suspicious of programs that run scriptcode automatically (even before the mail is opened, mind you) without asking me first.
</STRONG>

Well my anti-virus takes care of that problem
Just as long as I'm not in the "first wave" of an virus-strike, I should be okay.
I've got both a firewall for thoese nasty trojan vira and hacker attemp and anti-virus for thoese nasty email-vira

Originally posted by Silur:
<STRONG>Well, Sircam and Nimda pretty much blew "don't open suspicious emails" out of the water as a protection mechanism... I'm voting for the return of textbased, non-executable, non-mime-multipart-multimedia-enhanced mail with ascii art and non-graphic-enhanced smilies 8-\.</STRONG>

True they did, but they are two out of many thousands

Well youv'e got my vote Although i do like graphic smilies

<STRONG>Speaking of work, maybe I'd better go there... _very_ quickly! Spamming is dangerous, losing track of time... and space. Or, as they said in the bad, old days, L8r </STRONG>

Seeyah, enjoy *smurk* work

Originally posted by Mr Sleep:
<STRONG>True they did, but they are two out of many thousands </STRONG>

It only takes one. It isn't a statistical matter

<STRONG>
Well youv'e got my vote Although i do like graphic smilies </STRONG>

Ok, you get graphical smilies as long as you vote for me. Hey wait, what's wrong with this picture? Did I just turn into a politician?

<STRONG>Seeyah, enjoy *smurk* work </STRONG>

By sheer coincidence, a key person couldn't make it to the meeting, so it got cancelled . I guess I'll just get on with my loitering here...

[ 10-17-2001: Message edited by: Silur ]

Originally posted by Xandax:
<STRONG>Well my anti-virus takes care of that problem
Just as long as I'm not in the "first wave" of an virus-strike, I should be okay.
I've got both a firewall for thoese nasty trojan vira and hacker attemp and anti-virus for thoese nasty email-vira </STRONG>

Armed to the teeth, I see. Well, unless you're a particularly interesting target, you're pretty safe and vile hacker will go on to simpler targets and more unsuspecting hunting grounds

Originally posted by Silur:
<STRONG>By sheer coincidence, a key person couldn't make it to the meeting, so it got cancelled . I guess I'll just get on with my loitering here...</STRONG>

I bet yo uare just so annoied you couldn't waste time in that meeting

Are you lonely?

Hate having to make decisions?

Rather talk about it then do it?

Then why not Hold a Meeting

You can:

Get to see other people
Sleep in peace
Offlaod decisions
Learn to write volumes of meaningless notes
Feel important
Impress (or bore) your colleagues

And all in work time

Meetings - the practical alternative to work

Originally posted by Silur:
<STRONG>Ok, you get graphical smilies as long as you vote for me. Hey wait, what's wrong with this picture? Did I just turn into a politician?
</STRONG>

Perhaps you can go up against Weasel in the upcoming elections

Originally posted by Mr Sleep:
<STRONG>I bet yo uare just so annoied you couldn't waste time in that meeting
<snip>
Meetings - the practical alternative to work </STRONG>

Yepp. But that only describes the normal run of things. I work for a government agency

Doing a quick estimate, by not holding that meeting, we saved some $1000 - that is, 6 people, all consultants, two hours... I should get a tax deduction

<STRONG>Perhaps you can go up against Weasel in the upcoming elections </STRONG>

Nah, I have no yearning for power. I just want to build a high, round tower in some desolate area and do some arcane experiments.

Originally posted by Silur:
<STRONG>Doing a quick estimate, by not holding that meeting, we saved some $1000 - that is, 6 people, all consultants, two hours... I should get a tax deduction </STRONG>

LOL Consultants, the name for a job where you can't be bothered to give your profession a name

Shouldn't we all?

<STRONG>
Nah, I have no yearning for power. I just want to build a high, round tower in some desolate area and do some arcane experiments.</STRONG>

The dream of every (meglomanical) man Although i think Waverly achieved this dream for a few months