Character creation/gameplay hints

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GawainBS
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Character creation/gameplay hints

Postby GawainBS » Wed Sep 28, 2011 8:54 am

Since Bloodlines is almost finished, I'm going to start Redemption. I haven't found any good guides with regards to character creation/evolution and tactics, so here's me posting.

I like my main character to be in the thick of things, going full-out melee. What stats to focus on? Which Disciplines? Is it useful to develope Ranged Weapons?
How to develop companions?

Thanks in advance!

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Postby Lemmus » Wed Sep 28, 2011 10:31 am

Don't over think this, Redemption is not Bloodlines. It doesn't have anywhere near the level of character customisation you'll be used to.

For a quick overview of what you can expect, read chapter 2.0 of the walkthrough at GameFAQs: Vampire: The Masquerade - Redemption (PC) FAQ/Walkthrough by Yawgmoth_ .

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Postby GawainBS » Wed Sep 28, 2011 11:30 am

I read that guide already, and I didn't learn anything new. I'm also slightly sceptical about it, since I read some things like "And this gear will make your character look better." Not the kind of advice I want to base my XP spending on. ;)
Since I recall this game being very combat-intensive, I really want to know how it works.

I also remember never gaining a point of humanity, despite always choosing "Good" options. How come?

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Postby Tricky » Wed May 23, 2012 1:58 am

You still want some help with this? The thread seemed a little old to me, but I noticed you wrote in the other topic.

  • I like my main character to be in the thick of things, going full-out melee. What stats to focus on?
Strength, Dexterity and Stamina, in that order. Dexterity increases your chances to get a 'critical hit', an instant kill in this game, so it's useful even for non-ranged characters.

  • Which Disciplines?
For Melee? Potence and Fortitude are your friends, just like in Bloodlines. Other builds have been known to include one of the blood rituals, Prison of Ice, to immobilize creatures while you attack them. It can be effective, but requires you to spread out your attribute points out widely for the better part of the game. I don't think that's really worth it. Finally, I think it is possible to play the game without using disciplines (aside from heal), as long as your base attributes are in order. Something to consider (edit: certain enemies such as wraiths only take 'aggravated damage', which means you need either a weapon that can deal that kind of damage (hard to come by early in the game), or someone with the Protean discipline Feral Claws).

  • Is it useful to develop Ranged Weapons?
I think the ranged weapons in the second half of the game are pretty satisfying.
You'll also encounter some pretty powerful ranged weapon users, but not before the second half of the game. Some will shoot wooden stakes at you, which will paralyze you before you can get within melee distance. Having a gun around to pick them off from a distance can be useful, especially if you don't have any ranged disciplines to cast at them.
Note that the AI is dumber than dumb. Groups won't react to one being attacked/killed as long as you are too far away from them. This means you can usually get out of any situation by being exceedingly careful with positioning your guys.

  • How to develop companions?
I usually keep them melee in medieval times and ranged in modern times. Ranged weapons become much better later in the game, though I guess it really doesn't matter much either way. A matter of taste, mostly. I can think of at least one boss in the modern age that is easiest dealt with using ranged weapon, so you might want to consider having at least one of your companions get good at it.
I also like to develop one character in either time period with *only* high manipulation, nothing else, to sell and buy items with. Get stinking rich, deck out everyone with the best armors, early in the game (shops restock if you quit and reload a game).
Speaking of armors, only the medieval armors have strength requirements. If melee is not your goal, the points might be better spend elsewhere.

  • I also remember never gaining a point of humanity, despite always choosing "Good" options. How come?
This isn't really the case, though the loss/gain messages can be a little bit subtle, or disappear entirely because the game loads a different map during a cutscene.
There are maybe 6 to 8 points in the game where you can lose or gain humanity, although you can always lose some by killing innocent civilians. These moments tend to stand out, sometimes so much that they almost break with Kristof's character ('I want to stay in bed for a month' / 'Nah, let's forget about Anezka').
Sometimes it isn't entirely clear though. Good christian humanists for example *don't* want you to euthanize Luther Black, which may confuse the odd player since he does seem to be suffering. The game again chooses to act strange when you face the boss in the Society of Leopold. He attacks you first and is clearly a bastard throughout the levels, but killing him somehow still results into a loss of humanity. The alternative is to (spoiler: [SPOILER]destroy the barrels of blood around him instead[/SPOILER]).
[INDENT][SIZE="1"][font="Courier New"]'..[color="White"]t[/color]olerance w[color="White"]h[/color]en fog rolls in clouds unfold your selfless wings fe[color="White"]a[/color]thers [color="White"]t[/color]hat float from arabesque pillows I sold to be consumed by the [color="White"]s[/color]now white cold if only the plaster could hold withstand the flam[url="http://bit.ly/foT0XQ"]e[/url] then this fountain torch [color="White"]w[/color]ould know no shame and be outstripped only by the sun that burns with the glory and [color="White"]h[/color]onor of [color="White"]y[/color]our..'[/font][/size][/INDENT]

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Postby GawainBS » Wed May 23, 2012 3:05 am

Thanks! I enjoy a good melee'er myself, so that advice was very useful. I do recall picking up a sword which did aggravated damage and stole blood. Does it transfer to the modern time?
Thanks as well for clarifying those Humanity Gains. I find them pretty obscure here.

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Postby Tricky » Wed May 23, 2012 3:08 am

Yes. All artifacts seem to transfer to the modern time. This includes special items, rings, amulets, statues, crosses, weapons etc that you would have to identify first, if you found them as random loot. Money however doesn't, so it can be a good investment. I think I used to buy a lot of expensive amulets and rings, that take up little inventory space. I'd sell anything big that I didn't need anyway (eye of gangrel, femur of tzimisce, etc) and replace it with smaller things.
[INDENT][SIZE="1"][font="Courier New"]'..[color="White"]t[/color]olerance w[color="White"]h[/color]en fog rolls in clouds unfold your selfless wings fe[color="White"]a[/color]thers [color="White"]t[/color]hat float from arabesque pillows I sold to be consumed by the [color="White"]s[/color]now white cold if only the plaster could hold withstand the flam[url="http://bit.ly/foT0XQ"]e[/url] then this fountain torch [color="White"]w[/color]ould know no shame and be outstripped only by the sun that burns with the glory and [color="White"]h[/color]onor of [color="White"]y[/color]our..'[/font][/size][/INDENT]

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Postby GawainBS » Wed May 23, 2012 3:27 am

Nice. Perhaps, after having played all the other games I want to first, I'll tackle Redemption again. Thanks for the excellent advice.

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Postby Tricky » Wed May 23, 2012 3:55 am

Heh, no problem. Always glad to help. The classics need a little love too. :)

I was going to play Bloodlines 'now' and save Redemption until the WoD MMO was close to being finished, but I realized it would be better to give Wesp more time to work on his patches and just play Redemption instead. ;)
[INDENT][SIZE="1"][font="Courier New"]'..[color="White"]t[/color]olerance w[color="White"]h[/color]en fog rolls in clouds unfold your selfless wings fe[color="White"]a[/color]thers [color="White"]t[/color]hat float from arabesque pillows I sold to be consumed by the [color="White"]s[/color]now white cold if only the plaster could hold withstand the flam[url="http://bit.ly/foT0XQ"]e[/url] then this fountain torch [color="White"]w[/color]ould know no shame and be outstripped only by the sun that burns with the glory and [color="White"]h[/color]onor of [color="White"]y[/color]our..'[/font][/size][/INDENT]

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Postby GawainBS » Wed May 23, 2012 4:14 am

Is he still planning to add even more?

I plan on develop my party (Middle Ages) like this:

Christoph: Melee
Willem: Melee (Claws)
Woman (Forgot her name :p ): Disciplines/Ranged
Other Guy: Melee or Ranged? I'd say melee, as in this time, Ranged isn't THAT good, right?

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Postby Tricky » Wed May 23, 2012 5:46 am

GawainBS wrote:Is he still planning to add even more?

I was asking myself that same question, many years ago. I see no reason to stop asking it. ;)

Christoph: Melee
Willem: Melee (Claws)
Woman (Forgot her name :p ): Disciplines/Ranged
Other Guy: Melee or Ranged? I'd say melee, as in this time, Ranged isn't THAT good, right?


I'm just not a fan of middle-age Ranged combat. You can get ONE special bow in the first Tremere chantry and I have seen a 'fire bow' or something spawn in the stores at times. Other Guy (Erik) starts out with a lot of points in Strength so it makes sense to have him be a melee guy.
The same goes for Woman (forgot her name too), she starts out as a discipline user.

Willem or Kristof seem to be the best available options for ranged combat during the Middle Ages. The problem however is that for either of them to be ranged, another needs to provide decent melee support. Unless you're really careful about it, that is actually quite hard to pull off with just two party members. Especially the first bows you find / can buy are just too weak. I do however believe that it is possible and that it would prove to be a decent challenge.
Another, curious point about Willem are his modern age statistics. They are not the statistics you left him with at the end of the Middle Age section of the game. If memory serves, he has become more of a ranged user.

Some other notes on ranged combat:
- I do not know what the alternate attack (default: middle mouse click) does for ranged combat with bows and crossbows. Guns simply 'burst' shoot a couple of rounds at the same time with a longer reload time. Bows.. no idea. For all I know there is some kind of great advantage to it that I completely missed.
- Also, with ranged weapons it is possible to alt-click on anything you want to hit. This means that you don't have to target a specific enemy. This can be useful once you get your hands on a chaingun, as it allows you to do widespread crowd damage rather than just 1 on 1 damage.

I like to give Erik one of those giant 2-handed axes since he just looks good with it. :laugh:
[INDENT][SIZE="1"][font="Courier New"]'..[color="White"]t[/color]olerance w[color="White"]h[/color]en fog rolls in clouds unfold your selfless wings fe[color="White"]a[/color]thers [color="White"]t[/color]hat float from arabesque pillows I sold to be consumed by the [color="White"]s[/color]now white cold if only the plaster could hold withstand the flam[url="http://bit.ly/foT0XQ"]e[/url] then this fountain torch [color="White"]w[/color]ould know no shame and be outstripped only by the sun that burns with the glory and [color="White"]h[/color]onor of [color="White"]y[/color]our..'[/font][/size][/INDENT]

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Postby GawainBS » Wed May 23, 2012 6:36 am

Seems like it will be an all-melee party minus Selina, whol'll use bows/disciplines. (I believe that that was her name.)

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Postby Tricky » Wed May 23, 2012 7:32 am

That should do fine. Good luck when you get around to playing it. :)
[INDENT][SIZE="1"][font="Courier New"]'..[color="White"]t[/color]olerance w[color="White"]h[/color]en fog rolls in clouds unfold your selfless wings fe[color="White"]a[/color]thers [color="White"]t[/color]hat float from arabesque pillows I sold to be consumed by the [color="White"]s[/color]now white cold if only the plaster could hold withstand the flam[url="http://bit.ly/foT0XQ"]e[/url] then this fountain torch [color="White"]w[/color]ould know no shame and be outstripped only by the sun that burns with the glory and [color="White"]h[/color]onor of [color="White"]y[/color]our..'[/font][/size][/INDENT]