Gender in RPG

[Lady Dragonfly]

Originally Posted by GawainBS

Ladey Dragonfly, that's my whole point: Platemail does weigh more, but it is easier to move around in than Chainmail. Chainmail hangs down from the shoulders and drags your arms with it. This is a common similar: Take a heavy sweater, and soak it in water and wear that. Now use a belt to buckle it around you waist and under your armpits. That gives a nice impression.
Not to say that you or I could jump in a suit of platemail and start prancing about. It still requires training.
I don't really get it, with that article. It's intresting, but how does it show that women can't wear as much armour as men? It just said that those new plates where optional in most regions, and probably get mandatory sometime in the future.

The article shows that heavy armor, with its weight distributed as evenly as the modern technology can possibly offer, affects mobility and is almost unbearable in hot weather.
Discussing protection in terms of AC in RPG, high dexterity will give you as much protection as heavy armor. Heavy armor negates DEX bonuses for a good reason - it restricts mobility and maneuverability. It is more realistic imo to give fem PC a lower STR, a higher DEX and a lighter armor (e.g. leather), even if she is a fighter, which is not the most interesting class anyway.

I personally prefer a rogue with high INT and DEX.

@ Domi Ash
Gawain is right, you should try Amazon. You can buy a used game just for a few bucks there.

[Domi_Ash]

Both Kults are the same game. One is the US title, the other the European. If you really want to get it, I got mine from Amazon.co.uk for +/- 7£, including shipping.

Shipping where? You see, Amazon is notorious about not posting the mailing charges upright, and I had 10$ shipping on a 1.50 $ book once added to my bill without asking and had to go to the company to cancel the payment. Amazon.ca does not carry it, and the americain one doesn't carry it for cheap (and will probably try to add a huge surcharge on shipping anyway). The local EB games has never heard of it (and they got rid of the bargain bin on PC games long time ago anyways, grr.).

[GawainBS]

It's not strictly Amazon. It's second-hand. Most of those sellers are very helpful and will answer you if you mail them. The 2£ rate can apply worldwide, since I got it for an item (I think it was Kult) that shipped from the US, and I live in Belgium.

[Domi_Ash]

Well, I wrote to the seller, hopefully I will get a responce and some reasonable charge. And if I miss the party, but love the main story, I guess I can always adopt it for NWN2, since the folks say it's a small game.

[Domi_Ash]

Well, no luck. Got the 'ship only within UK' reply. Plus, I think I've lost what little enthusiasm I've had for this game anyway.

[Lady Dragonfly]

Originally Posted by Domi_Ash

Well, no luck. Got the 'ship only within UK' reply. Plus, I think I've lost what little enthusiasm I've had for this game anyway.

Sorry to hear that. Have you tried US Amazon? I recently purchased a book from a UK seller, and the shipping charge was as low as $3-4, the same as within the US.

Sidetracking, here is a small article that offers an explanation why male gamers often choose a female protagonist:

By day, Freeman Williams manages a small dental practice in suburban Houston. But on any given night, he's prowling crime-ridden streets and battling ne'er-do-wells in the video game "City of Heroes" as his virtual alter-ego: a female superhero named Robotrixie.
"I get in character voice-wise as much as my male voice will allow," explains Williams, 48, who talks with other players through the game's voice chat feature. "This has become my catharsis, my escape from the work world."
…
For many, half the fun can be in the initial character creation process, where you decide the basic look and functions of your digital persona.
Among the crucial questions that need to be addressed: Do I want to heal or dish out damage? Do I prefer green-skinned orcs or pointy-eared elves? And of course, do I want to be male or female?
For a variety of reasons, Williams isn't the only guy with a preference for female characters, according to Kathryn Wright, a psychologist in Raleigh, N.C., who consults for the Web site WomenGamers.com.
In an informal survey she conducted with 64 males, more than half said choosing a female character gave them a distinct gameplay advantage. And while a quarter said they played women characters because it added to the role-playing experience, Wright said others had a simpler explanation: visual stimulation.
"They'd rather look at a character that looks like Lara Croft than a character that looks like Rambo," she said.
....
Erica Poole, a 31-year-old legal secretary in Austin, says she's picked up a few ways to spot a male disguised as a female in online games.

"The fact that they are scantily clad is a huge clue," she said. "And often the bigger the breasts, the more likely it's a guy."



Well, that probably explains why I play male protagonists: I prefer Rambo to Lara Croft…

[GawainBS]

I won't deny the truth in the article, but the girls I play in games have no big breasts (Personal preference.) and are decently armoured. Not that I eshew scant clothing, but I try to get what the character in question would wear. I don't mind naked legs, since I can imagine it would be due to mobility issues. (Compare to Roman Legionaires.) However, a cleavage a mile deep and exposed midrif is a bit too far, since it would also expose the heart, lungs and abdomen, for starters.
All in all, I don't mind the "scantly clad heroine", not at all, but I do mind it when it's the only option.
As for the help you get in MMOs if you play as a girl, that's true. I never abuse it, but I noticed I could have, if I wanted.

[Domi_Ash]

Sorry to hear that. Have you tried US Amazon?

No, I am not eligible: Please note: Buyers outside the U.S. cannot purchase the following types of items via Amazon Marketplace: video games, toy and baby items, electronics, cameras and photo items, tools and hardware, kitchenware and housewares, sporting goods and outdoor equipment, software, and computers.

As I live in Canada, I am not considered domestic by US Amazon.

[galraen]

I've now started out with a female F/C/M in BG2, I had been intending doing a trio, with two characters I've never gone through the game with, Minsc and Anomen, doing the Anomen romance. But I just couldn't hack it, the first conversation with Mr Slimeball Anomen was too much, so now going solo.

How anyone, especially females, can tolerate that scumbag is beyond me, and it does make me wonder about the folks at Bioware. How come the only romanceable male in the game is a proto-typical Male Chauvanist Pig, is that a reflection on their attitudes? Did the developers at Bioware base Anomen on themselves? I guess I shouldn't be too surprised, the computer gaming industry is notorious for being chauvanistic and sexist.

The types of female 'armour' typically found in fantasy games says it all really. Actually calling it armour should be actionable under the trades description act.

[GawainBS]

I have to confirm that Anomen is actually quite better after he is knighted. Still not the type of guy I'd fall for if I were a girl, but he was tolerable. He was arrogant still, but more in a "He's a good guy in the end, I'll put up with him"-kind of way.

On a side note: I found it annoying that any and all portraits from BGII feature people with earrings and most of them have dreadlocks or hair with lots of beads intertwined. Apart from the fact that I don't like any of those, I found the amount present quite over-done.

[Lady Dragonfly]

Originally Posted by galraen

I've now started out with a female F/C/M in BG2, I had been intending doing a trio, with two characters I've never gone through the game with, Minsc and Anomen, doing the Anomen romance. But I just couldn't hack it, the first conversation with Mr Slimeball Anomen was too much, so now going solo.

Anomen's bitterness and emotional instability come from what they call "troubled childhood". If the bad boy is knighted, his attitude changes, maybe because he gets +2 bonus to his wisdom. His quest revolving around tragic family events is quite good imo. To me, the most annoying thing was Anomen's voice, not his attitude.

How anyone, especially females, can tolerate that scumbag is beyond me, and it does make me wonder about the folks at Bioware. How come the only romanceable male in the game is a proto-typical Male Chauvanist Pig, is that a reflection on their attitudes? Did the developers at Bioware base Anomen on themselves? I guess I shouldn't be too surprised, the computer gaming industry is notorious for being chauvanistic and sexist.

I guess scarceness of romanceable males reflects gaming statistics: this is boys' world.
A dark, brooding misfit knight is probably Bioware’s version of “most eligible bachelor”: Anomen, Casavir… or Carth who was kinda a brooding Jedi knight.

Originally Posted by GawainBS

On a side note: I found it annoying that any and all portraits from BGII feature people with earrings and most of them have dreadlocks or hair with lots of beads intertwined. Apart from the fact that I don't like any of those, I found the amount present quite over-done.

I agree - I find those ethnic hairdos and body piercing excessive and tasteless, in a fantasy RPG. And if you recall Nameless One, he had a similar Bad Hair Day.

[GawainBS]

Originally Posted by Lady Dragonfly

I agree - I find those ethnic hairdos and body piercing excessive and tasteless, in a fantasy RPG. And if you recall Nameless One, he had a similar Bad Hair Day.

It's true about TNO, but he was one character. No problem with that. No problem if it was *just* Aerie, *or* Jaheira, *or* Anomen, *or*...
Anyway, to keep it on subject, I think this might be an example of why you would play the other gender, because the first didn't have anything that suited your fancy. I'm thinking of NWN here. I hated playing human males, because all of them were broad-shouldered gorillas and there were very few heads which appealed to me. In general, there were very few heads at all that I liked. A few "oddball" choices are nice, but not 10 heads which look like they came from a punk rock festival, 5 with horns and 2 that look like they were humped by an orc. What's wrong with a girl or guy with a ponytail, single braid, an up-do hairdress, close-shaved military crop, or twin pigtails?
So, to conclude: my choice of gender is sometimes determined by the options available to them.

[Domi_Ash]

I have to say that I started to tolerate Anomen after other romanceable options for the female PC became available (via mods). I really disliked him beforehand, but as a non-romanceable he is just a jerk. As romanceable, I could never see that 'change' people keep talking about. I basically had all my talks with him before he was knighted, then he pressed me into telling him that I really, really love him while holding the sword to the throats of two innocent kids (I chose the path earlier in romance where I told him that I don't love him but will sleep with him -which he accepted against all the knightly expectations!!!)... Yeah, very knightly.

Truly, I have no idea why both Gaider and Avalonne (with Gann) feel that a female romantic interest has to come accross as an intolerable bastard to start with and presumably end up as cute and vurnerable underneath. They don't do that to the male PC romantic interests by some reason; you either like them or dislike them, but what you see is pretty much what you get.

[Lady Dragonfly]

Originally Posted by Domi_Ash

I have to say that I started to tolerate Anomen after other romanceable options for the female PC became available (via mods). I really disliked him beforehand, but as a non-romanceable he is just a jerk. As romanceable, I could never see that 'change' people keep talking about. I basically had all my talks with him before he was knighted, then he pressed me into telling him that I really, really love him while holding the sword to the throats of two innocent kids (I chose the path earlier in romance where I told him that I don't love him but will sleep with him -which he accepted against all the knightly expectations!!!)... Yeah, very knightly.

After Anomen's quest is over and he is knighted, he pretty much shuts up. That is a very positive change, imo. If memory serves, he even apologizes to Keldorn.
As for "knightly" behavior, people usually entertain the notion that knights were paragons of virtue while in fact they were drunkards, cutthroats and rapists. I would say, historically, medieval nobility was comprised of fallen paladins and evil clerics.
So, Anomen and his dipsomaniac Dad are rather realistic characters.

[Domi_Ash]

Well, Baldur's Gate is hardly a historic work. It's fantasy, and the knightly image in fantasy is romatisised, so I don't see much value in introducing gritty realism in this particular aspect. I have to say that BG1's Ajantis romance fits my expectations of a romance with a paladin much more accurately... Besides, Jaheira is not exactly a maddened knife-wielding priestess eager to perform dark and bloody rituals in the mystic groves. The Order in the FR setting and the paladins are (at least per the brochure shipping with the game) paragons of virtue.