Character Stats - what should I pump up and what should I dump?

bariumdose · #1 (**permalink**) 10-03-2005, 04:24 PM

My apologies if this has been answered in another thread. I'm having problems using my search function.

In character creation, what attibutes can be minimized without much penalties for this game? I've seen a few posts that say that wisdom is not very useful unless you're a cleric.

Also, for the paladin, druid, and ranger class, what minimum wisdom is needed for them to cast spells? Is it 14? What's the maximum caster level allowed for these classes? Similarly, do you need an 18 for a mage to be able to cast all levels of mage spells?

Thanks for your help

Ravager · #2 (**permalink**) 10-03-2005, 04:30 PM

What you describe is more applicable to the newer D&D rules. In IWD1, higher stats grant extra spell slots but don't limit you to spell levels.

Generally I keep the stats around 10 or above, but I don't believe there are penalties to saving throws for reducing stats to their minimums.

The minimums will be different for different classes dependent on whether they use the stat or not, but I don't think there are any restrictions to spell access, just the possible bonus slots, which are worth getting.

bariumdose · #3 (**permalink**) 10-03-2005, 04:41 PM

Great! Thanks for the info.

So if I have my paladin at a minimum 10 Wisdom, he would still have access to all the priest spells once he gets to level 9 (or whatever the minimum level he has to reach before he can cast spells)? And the only benefit to boosting his wisdom any higher is just to get bonus spell slots?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ravager

What you describe is more applicable to the newer D&D rules. In IWD1, higher stats grant extra spell slots but don't limit you to spell levels.

Generally I keep the stats around 10 or above, but I don't believe there are penalties to saving throws for reducing stats to their minimums.

The minimums will be different for different classes dependent on whether they use the stat or not, but I don't think there are any restrictions to spell access, just the possible bonus slots, which are worth getting.

Ravager · #4 (**permalink**) 10-03-2005, 04:53 PM

I think so, yeah. Something to check in the manual once I email it to you...

bariumdose · #5 (**permalink**) 10-03-2005, 05:36 PM

Argghh - that darn missing manual! I feel like the guy from the Greatest American Hero TV show with the supersuit and no manual on how to use the superpowers!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ravager

I think so, yeah. Something to check in the manual once I email it to you...

krunchyfrogg · #6 (**permalink**) 10-03-2005, 09:54 PM

You can download the manual on sorcerers.net

The manual has a lot of pasted rules from the AD&D game that were not actually implemented into the game IWD, such as spell failure and level limits.

Aerich · #7 (**permalink**) 10-04-2005, 01:08 AM

All classes that need a certain stat have class-specific minimums in that stat. For Wisdom, Pal is 13, Ranger is 14 (I think), and Cleric is 9. I think Druid is 12. For major spellcasting classes (Cleric, Druid) max the Wis. You can get away with the minimums for Pal and Ranger. High Wis gives priests bonus spell slots.

Arcane spellcasters (mage, specialist mage, bard) should have Int as high as it can go. It affects the chance to learn spells and the number of spells you can learn per level, not the number of spell slots per day. It also affects Lore, which allows you to identify items (using a rightclick) without a spell.

Priests can drop their Int and wizards can drop their Wis with almost no effect. The biggest effect game-wise is that Lore is dependent on Int and Wis and will be lower if one of the two is dropped. There may be a few dialogue choices affected, but nothing major. The dialogue is linear anyway, with few choices and little effect except the occasional opportunity for more XP.

"Powergame" stat breakdown is as follows:

Warriors: max Str, max Dex, max Con, minimum everything else - better Wis for Pal and Ranger if possible.
Priests: max Wis, 16 Con, max Dex, good Str, Int and Cha don't matter (but druid has minimum Cha of 15)
Wizards: max Int, max Dex, 16 Con, medium Str, Wis and Cha don't matter
Thieves: max Dex, 16 Con, good Str, nothing else necessary
Bard: max Dex, max Con, 16 Str, max Int, Wis doesn't matter, class minimum for Cha.

Note that it is helpful to have one character with 18 Cha so you can get the best prices from the shops. If using dual or multiclass characters, simply combine the two necessary classes above and take the higher value for each stat. Some classes are hard to roll if you want the best possible starting stats - fighter/druid, paladin, and bard come to mind.

bariumdose · #8 (**permalink**) 10-05-2005, 10:48 AM

Hey, thanks for the advice on the stats, Aerich. Very helpful!

Maybe I'm getting 3rd or 3.5 edition rules mixed up with the 2nd edition AD&D rules, but for my paladin and ranger, wouldn't giving him higher Wis give him bonus spell slots? Or, does it not matter for IWD?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aerich

All classes that need a certain stat have class-specific minimums in that stat. For Wisdom, Pal is 13, Ranger is 14 (I think), and Cleric is 9. I think Druid is 12. For major spellcasting classes (Cleric, Druid) max the Wis. You can get away with the minimums for Pal and Ranger. High Wis gives priests bonus spell slots.

Arcane spellcasters (mage, specialist mage, bard) should have Int as high as it can go. It affects the chance to learn spells and the number of spells you can learn per level, not the number of spell slots per day. It also affects Lore, which allows you to identify items (using a rightclick) without a spell.

Priests can drop their Int and wizards can drop their Wis with almost no effect. The biggest effect game-wise is that Lore is dependent on Int and Wis and will be lower if one of the two is dropped. There may be a few dialogue choices affected, but nothing major. The dialogue is linear anyway, with few choices and little effect except the occasional opportunity for more XP.

"Powergame" stat breakdown is as follows:

Warriors: max Str, max Dex, max Con, minimum everything else - better Wis for Pal and Ranger if possible.
Priests: max Wis, 16 Con, max Dex, good Str, Int and Cha don't matter (but druid has minimum Cha of 15)
Wizards: max Int, max Dex, 16 Con, medium Str, Wis and Cha don't matter
Thieves: max Dex, 16 Con, good Str, nothing else necessary
Bard: max Dex, max Con, 16 Str, max Int, Wis doesn't matter, class minimum for Cha.

Note that it is helpful to have one character with 18 Cha so you can get the best prices from the shops. If using dual or multiclass characters, simply combine the two necessary classes above and take the higher value for each stat. Some classes are hard to roll if you want the best possible starting stats - fighter/druid, paladin, and bard come to mind.

krunchyfrogg · #9 (**permalink**) 10-05-2005, 02:59 PM

The only people who get bonus spells from a high wisdom are clerics and druids.

Endugu · #10 (**permalink**) 10-06-2005, 01:47 PM

Just a minor correction to Aerich's post:
Bards dont need maxed (18) costitution - in fact, besides the three warrior classes, a character doesnt benefit from a CON higher than 16.
Only warrior classes (ranger, fighter, paladin) get additional hitpoints for having a CON above 16.

bariumdose · #11 (**permalink**) 10-06-2005, 08:19 PM

Hey, thank you everyone for being so helpful to an IWD newbie.

I had a question regarding notation. In the stats tables of the manual, I see a notation in the ability score of 18/01-50, 18/51-75, etc. What do these mean?

bariumdose · #12 (**permalink**) 10-06-2005, 08:23 PM

oops, I had a followup:

Under Constitution, HP adjustment, I see things like +2(+3), +2(+4). What do these indicate?

bariumdose · #13 (**permalink**) 10-06-2005, 08:24 PM

Sorry, I figured out what the +2(+3), etc mean. I need to read ahead in the manual - lol

Ravager · #14 (**permalink**) 10-07-2005, 04:46 AM

You should probably just edit one post... no offence.

You found out the meaning of the numbers next to 18+ stats?
What do they mean? I always wondered...

I know they signify greater strength than 18 but why don't they either limit the game to max 18 STR or go on to 19+ STR?

Aerich · #15 (**permalink**) 10-10-2005, 01:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Endugu

Just a minor correction to Aerich's post:
Bards dont need maxed (18) costitution - in fact, besides the three warrior classes, a character doesnt benefit from a CON higher than 16.
Only warrior classes (ranger, fighter, paladin) get additional hitpoints for having a CON above 16.

Absolutely right. I was typing too fast and didn't proof it.

Quote:

You found out the meaning of the numbers next to 18+ stats?
What do they mean? I always wondered...

I know they signify greater strength than 18 but why don't they either limit the game to max 18 STR or go on to 19+ STR?

It's just a notation system. Non-warriors are limited to 18 Str, 18/xx Str is called "exceptional" Str, is only available to warriors, and gives greater bonuses. It's a warrior-only perk.

Str of 19 and up is considered beyond the physical limits of the human body without magical aid. It's restricted to giants, giantkin, and magical or extraplanar creatures.