Ideas/Discussion for Fable 2 ***NO SPAM***

[Ducky02]

yes but that would mean that they would need to create a worldbuilder as well as the actual game. plus they would need to make it online enabled all that would probably take away from the game, seeing they were already limited in the first one. and if they made the next fable ok but with an awesome online feature, then we would be complaining about how the plot was no better or longer than the first. the only solution to this would be if they decided to release it on x-box 2, but that will be quite a long wait, and only if x-box 2 had an even better game memory and such.

basically ,itl be complicated to satify everyone with what they want to see =P

[Polyphemus]

Improvements for Fable to be transitioned to Fable 2:

1. Far too short and not enough story depth:

This game was almost comically short for an RPG. Getting through any Role Playing Game in under ten hours should be flat out impossible. Add to this the comparatively (to other more in-depth RPGs) thin main storyline, absence of true side-quests, limited character progression, and predictable nature of the main story structure, it winds up being a (again, comparatively) pretty weak gaming experience.
It would have been nice to see some sort of branching storyline that changes circumstances when persuing the altruistic path or defiling your soul with evil deeds, more options with spouses than sex and abuse, some tweaks to the writing to make it more concise and less fantastic or dramatic, and some real NPCs that you can feel like you're truly interacting with.

2. A streaming transition between sections of the map:

This was a pretty big problem for me as I always play video games very critically, and at the same time as if I were inside the world (suspending disbelief and all). The requisite loading of every section of the map really broke up the continuity (congruency?) of the experience and made me care less about what happened where I was coming from because it took so long to get where I was going to. In other words, It just wasn't fun hitting a twenty or thirty second load space when I was just running from section to section of the map. As this game was in development for five years or so, I would think that they could have found a way to do this. San Andreas loads an entire city in the time it takes Fable to load a small map, and while Fable has more graphical detail, it is still not defendably true to say that there is nothing that could have been done.

3. Storyline brickwall:

At a certain point in the game the story just hit a wall. There was nothing that could be done other than the main missions, and for an supposedly open-ended game like Fable, this is inexcusable. Add to this the fact that there are no real missions to accomplish after the end of the story, it ends pretty abruptly.
(Fable 2 idea: Having some sort of office in every town where locals come to complain about their problems and offer rewards for solving them. Like a bounty office, but one that specializes in more than just assassination missions. This could include spy missions where you need to sneak around to gain information, running protection for businesses, helping villagers raise money to open a business, run a bake sale, whatever a creative mind could think up...)

4. More specialization in armour and tattoos:

People have a wider range of emotions than enthusiastic applause and crippling fear when confronted by your character. For instance, in Fable there are multiple tattoos that have different descriptions (assassin by night, Bowerstone nobility, fertility, etc.). Having different tattoo sets could cause villagers to talk with you about more specific things, ask you to complete tasks for them based on your appearance, etc. Wearing bright leather armour makes them see you as a ranger of sorts, to be moderately respected, but also at ease with. Dark Platemail causes people to show you respect and hold their tounges. This was done to a degree in Fable, but some more emphasis on it would make the experience much more enveloping.

5. OTHER AREAS OF THE MAP:

Being able to visit other areas of the map without having a modded XBox and industry-standard programming skills is crucial, CRUCIAL, to any immersive RPG experience. Especially seeing that the other sections have names and could have maps that go along with them, and showing the entire world map and having a quarter of it be accessable, makes the game feel weaker. If more time was focused in on getting these areas into the release version of the game and less on designing different haircuts and tattoos, then this would have been a much stronger game.

6. More longevity, NPC aging, siring children, making real friends:

All of these rolled into one. Reaching the age of 65 with white hair by the tenth mission in the game should be impossible. I for one need to be able to relate somewhat to my character in any game, certainly and particularly in an RPG, and I find it harder to relate to a wrinkled, faded senior citizen than to a black haired, devious miscreant. My spouse also stays the same age regardless of the age of my character, which doesn't seem right. The ability to have sex seems like a fun past-time, but without the ability to see anything come from it other than incessant pillow talk every time I see my "wife" detracts from the experience and makes it get old quick. And I would have loved to be able to really recognize different villagers, differentiate between them, and know one better than another. Maybe a few limited dialogue options in the Expressions list,e.g. "how you doing?/Hi to the wife./Job going well?, etc.", having some more ranged and different gifts than chocolates and roses, to give to good friends, not prospective lovers, just a more rounded experience in dealing with other people in the game. When the bandits say, "This could be the start of a terrifying friendship." I would like for that to have some truth to it.

Improved Stealth:

Have the stealth in the game be more pervasive, not having people spin around unprovoked and stare at you while you try to stealth kill them. This is one of the more annoying, albeit minor, problems I had with Fable, wearing the assassin outfit should turn you into an assassin. This means a system recognizing when people's backs are turned, a way to kill enemies with one hit, and maybe even some varied animations for this action if we're lucky.

Arrows stick, magic burns, and cuts scratch:

Not necessarily in that order, or limited to those examples. All I mean by this is resolving one of the problems that most games face: realistic damage to the character. Scars is a good start, and something that most games (maybe no games now that I think about it) have implemented. But what about an arrow sticking into your character's arm or heart, and having damage based on where the attack lands.

In the same vein, magic attacks should have some sort of visible effect on your hero. This could be as simple as some scars that are specific to magic attacks, or more complex. I am no game designer, but Fable has one of the world's best and most innovative designers working on it, with a team of highly trained and creative specialists working on it. How about expanding on some of the ideas put forth in Fable.

Other than these, there are obviously hundreds of other ideas that could potentially fulfill this game's original claim; to be the best game of all time, RPG or otherwise. As Fable 2 is most likely already in the works in some form or another, I can't wait to see what they come up with.

[Ducky02]

also, when they said "every action: a consequence" i expected it to have more consequences than achieving good or evil points and having your alignment change, as mentioned before, physical changes! more magic makes the character weaker to physical attacks, and such. more consequences! my nights over now =) tired

[Frost Drake]

This idea is taken from my game(Not in production at the moment, need to find a studio to work for, prototype not done yet due to lack of resources.) but I'll hand it to Fable instead:

Binding weapons, every weapon is made of different ores and each ore have a % value as the damage on the weapon's shape and length. Through actions, the weapons change shape and become good or evil depending on how they are used. Example, if your 100% good through out the game, the weapon bonds to your hand and thus leaving a inventory space. 100% evil, the blade splits in two and can damage two targets simultaneously.

Each point on a weapon have different splash damage, blunt part have usually 5% damage which means if the weapon is 100 dmg for example, and you hit a Knight with plate armour in the chest just with the blunt portion. You would get 500(Knight HP)/5(Weapon Percent)*(100(Plate Chest piece)-77(Plate portion not protecting the area struck)-78(Player strength)*50(Force in area)/*not the real formula*/
and so on and so on, my maths are complicated but you should get the picture, the damage is real time and different.

And offcourse, Vertical and Horizontal attacks.

[penguin_king]

id like to see bloodstained swords in the game, mayb also the ability to wipe your sword on a dead bandits shirt

[joeko]

I'd like for our hero to be able to jump!!!... consequently for him to be able to levitate while using a spell... if jack was able to fly/levitate in the final battle why not our hero?

On regards to weapons.. I'd be better if you have to trade in your old weapon to get new one so that your inventory isn't so freaking long... or for you to be able to leave all the stuff at home and only take what you need, to be able to sit down and have a beer not to have to stand up for it.

Instead of having 2, 3 different stores.. make a single one with all the products, less time and more you can steal at a single spot

Underwater action.. have a spell which will protect you when underwater (swimming seems a little tacky) so you jump in the water and when you need to get out you levitate... like the time you needed to kill the water creature kryn something I think I forgot.. the one after you get out of prision and you are with your mom.... it would have been kool if you could have fought him underwater.

No Resurrection Phial!!! the only thing they are good for is to make money.

No Books!!! instead, have a library were you may go and read on stuff you need to know.

I guess that's it fr now

[Skuld]

I didn't read everyone's post, but my two biggest gripes about the game which I'd like to see remedied in a future game would be length and dialogue options. How can this be one of the greatest RPG's of all time, which some were spouting before it's release, if your only dialogue options are yes and no? And It's a real shame that if I want to I can start and finish an entire game skipping nothing in a weekend. That shouldn't be possible! Other things I'd like are more varieties of weapons(like someone said, maybe a spear or a staff), some form of character creation, or at least a pool of characters to choose from at the beginning, and for pete's sake use the whole damn disk when making a game, because I bet there was a lot of room left over on this one.

OH and not being able to sell legendary weapons kinda sucked.

One more thing.... a slightly larger variety of spells that are actually worth using.

[Ducky02]

the spell point is good, i noticed the only ones people normally ised were enflame and physical shield. sometimes berserk. (im not saying thats all, just mostly all anyone ever talks about) other things like force push and fureball is seemingly pointless, seeing that you have much better things like enflame that do the same job but inflict more damage
=)

[the torturedOne]

I apologize for not reading the other threads, but these are my thoughts on fable 2. I shall try to keep them organized.

Game Mechanics
Overall, I felt that this was the strongest part of Fable. the combat system was very solid, It was simple, easy to learn, and addictive. Building combat multipliers provided an effective distraction from the drudgery of the mindless killing. I wouldn't change this at all. The camera also was extremely flexible and of all of these type of games, I found Fable's easiest to work with. This I wouldn't change.

what I would change, however, is the user interface. I found it rather frustrating to hold the trigger and click "Y" until I find the spell I want, especially in the middle of combat. I had the "fart" emote on my little quick menu, and it stayed there despite my best efforts to change it. I would like to see them come up with a more streamlined system. I don't mind more doodads on my screen, as long as they are serving some sort of purpose.

game play

length
like probably most everyone else, I would have liked to see a far longer game. 50 - 70 hours would probably make for an epic game. If they made it too long they'd alienate many casual gamers. Of course, there would be nothing to stop them from adding numerous side quests and additions to increase it's length, to appease and reward the hardcore gamers.

the quests
in Fable, the progression of quests was rather linear. You start at A. get to B. I feel it had alot to due with the way the world was set up. I would like to see A: more involvement with the other guilders and B: a feeling of accomplishment. The best analogy I can come up with would be the difference between GTA3 and vice city. In GTA3 you start and end as a mere driver type. In Vice city you start as the delivery boy and end as the owner of pretty much the entire city. This is how I would prefer to see the quest system as well: a matrix of quests that branch out like a tree, rather than a linear set of quests.

For example, a person playing a lawful good character could take jobs for the temple of Avo, while chaotic good characters could do more ranger work for, say, Knothole Glade. Likewise, lawful evil characters could work for the Chapel of Skorm, while chaotic evil characters could work with the bandits. Like GTA2 to use GTA again, as you do jobs for certain factions, it closes and opens doors. But to add intrigue, they could throw in betrayal quests for people who like to play redeemed villians or fallen Paladins.

the world
I found Fable to be extremely linear. It is little more than a twisting line of paths. I would prefer to have seen it as a wide, expansive world. I felt a sense of claustrophobia while playing much of the game. an expansive world would open albion up in terms of exploration, and variety in even mundane quests like escort quests and what have you.

Romance
way too clockwork. The entirety of the romance system is that you go into a town, buy a house, pick your favorite female sprite, then flirt/sexypose/give gifts until she is ready to be married. I found this to be boring. While the idea that you decide your own spouse is innovative, it is boring story line wise, because other than getting a fresco, it doesn't contribute much. I would have much rather prefered a choice of 3 or 4 companions which were indepth, developed, and very pertinent to the story as opposed to what felt like being married to a piece of code. I for one, would have prefered the ability to romance Whisper, Briar Rose or Lady Grey as opposed to the cookie cutters I have to choose from. Quality, not quantity please.


character development

the avatar
a gender choice would have been nice, but I guess it would be pure aesthetics. more importantly, I would have liked to see more dialog options to further the character's personality. I mean here you are, deciding wether or not to murder your own sister, and your character just sort of stands there with a blank look on his face. I see the artistic point they were trying to make by making him virtually mute, but in a game where the player has to build everything about his character from stratch, it can be limiting. It works in Legend of Zelda because LoZ's story runs like it is on rails. There doesn't necessarily have to be a voice over, but simple KOTOR style choice system wouldn't hurt, even if they kept it limited

aging
The character aged 0.7 years everytime something was increased. I found this to be rather too high, thus a character had to be carefully planned out if you didn't want your character to finish past his late 30's. There is no doubting that the system is very innovative. But I would change it, either make it trigger-bound, or reduce the amount gained per raise.

as a side note, Why was your character the only one to age in Fable 1? I would like to see the rest of the world age with you. It doesn't have to be dead on faithful, just have triggers when you reach certain ages. When you hit 25, 38, 50, 65. etc. They don't need to change the generic villagers, but changes in the main NPCs. They could be subtle, but would be greatly apreciated by the players as going that extra mile.

alignment
the game was, quite frankly, biased towards the good, and this is coming from a habitual good player. I found that when I was playing evil that I had to go out of my way after many missions to keep my horns and red eyes. I would prefer a more open game.

bells and whistles
customizing hair color would have been nice. Nothing overly fancy, maybe just a black/brown/blond/red meter. same with eye color or even skin color.

also, the selection of equipment lacked any sort of aesthetic difference. I would want to see an extensive set of armors and weapons, different styles, colors, etc. Along with a de-centralization of the quest system, this would add an extreme amount of replayability, and customization that makes these types of games great.

[Rocko]

Ok so in this fable we all know that with a modded xbox you can acheive the dragon slaying thing well how about that you find a book called

'The Legacy of the Riders'

Its in elven or something but anywho you cant quite translate so you take it to the guildmaster.......

Of course he tells you that somehow Heros could form bonds with animals and dragons were among the most stuborn of all and Jack of Blades was
the only rider in all of Albion of course....

Your sent on a quest you kill a dragon and you stumble across its baby

you pick its color and name and then you raise it

[Ducky02]

too much harry potter for you there bud.

i believe that more customization would be a good thing, however, too much (character customization) would make the character grapics not as great. i believe that the toruredOne's comparisons to other games proved helpful, and i would just like to note, this game was alot like zelda, however, zelda was Longer if they were able to make zelda that long, on N64!!! then it is surely possible to have expanded fable

[Polyphemus]

Originally Posted by Frost Drake

Binding weapons, every weapon is made of different ores and each ore have a % value as the damage on the weapon's shape and length.

Have you ever played Vagrant's Story for the PS? It had something like what you're talking about, each weapon was made of different materials, and combining them created new and different weapons with their own specific abilities and looks. It was the best weapon combination system I've encountered in a game, and made VS, among some other reasons, one of my top ten all time favorite games.

If you could find a way to implement this and expand on it, I'd buy you're game in a heartbeat.

I also have suggested some of my ideas from a couple of games I've been designing, I just pray they don't patent them before I get a chance to (wait, if, not when). Here's hoping.

[Frost Drake]

Originally Posted by Polyphemus

Have you ever played Vagrant's Story for the PS? It had something like what you're talking about, each weapon was made of different materials, and combining them created new and different weapons with their own specific abilities and looks. It was the best weapon combination system I've encountered in a game, and made VS, among some other reasons, one of my top ten all time favorite games.

If you could find a way to implement this and expand on it, I'd buy you're game in a heartbeat.

I also have suggested some of my ideas from a couple of games I've been designing, I just pray they don't patent them before I get a chance to (wait, if, not when). Here's hoping.

Nope, my ideas are original. That is if you don't discriminate me for taking it from history, what I mean is forging and iron casting as in ores and materiality. I'm not into fantasy magic BS, my idea is that build your own weapons and damage distribution system, i.e. you can shape the blades to hit stronger on the upper end, lower end or anywhere in between.

I can be bothered with patents until I actually finish the prototype.

[the torturedOne]

That is a very innovative idea, Frost Drake. The idea that you could forge your own weapon using different ores and alloys (or even magic) to create new weapons of your own. They could potentially turn it into a mini-game, maybe a sort of "Simon" or something, where the more successful the person is within the mini-game, the more powerful the weapon becomes. To use an example of a greatly implemented mini-game system: God of War for the PS2 was great. They were simple "Press the button that flashed on the screen" games, but were amusing and looked wicked.

Additional magic infusing of the weapon could be a different mini-game altogether, and would have a lot more depth than the augmentation system of Fable 1. There could be several different ores, each one with their own strength and weakness, and finding new ore combinations would prove to be a rewarding distraction. Not to mention the aesthetic possibilities that comes with weapon creation. After creating a weapon, they could use the card system like Fable one used when deciding the grip, pommel, even engravings on the blade. A most intriguing idea

i believe that more customization would be a good thing, however, too much (character customization) would make the character grapics not as great. i believe that the toruredOne's comparisons to other games proved helpful, and i would just like to note, this game was alot like zelda, however, zelda was Longer if they were able to make zelda that long, on N64!!! then it is surely possible to have expanded fable

granted, but It's not like I asked for too much. Gender would be the primary difference at the start of the game, along with a slider that set skin tone and hair color, and possibly eye color. You are right in saying too much customization can be clunky, but I think the slight alterations I laid out would not significantly decrease graphical content, but would go a long way in character customization.

Zelda and Fable were similar only in the sense that they are action games, but Fable is far closer to an RPG and IMO had a lot more depth in terms of character development. Besides, I was able to beat Ocarina of Time in around 20 hours, so it wasn't that long. Still, if they could filch a 20 hour game out on an archaic cartrige system, than They have no excuse on a next-gen console like the Xbox 2.

[Frost Drake]

Additional magic infusing of the weapon could be a different mini-game altogether, and would have a lot more depth than the augmentation system of Fable 1. There could be several different ores, each one with their own strength and weakness, and finding new ore combinations would prove to be a rewarding distraction. Not to mention the aesthetic possibilities that comes with weapon creation. After creating a weapon, they could use the card system like Fable one used when deciding the grip, pommel, even engravings on the blade. A most intriguing idea

I have a idea for that too, except that the augmentation stays. But the augmentation have no effect without magic, you will need to charge up your magic power into the blades in order to use the augmentation's effects, this will open up a whole new way of customization as the amount of mana used determines the power of the augmentation effects and the number of effects applied.

Plus using magic to create augmentation is fun, and maybe addictive.

No HP bar, just magic. 100% health is all you've got, 1 thrust through the body, you are dead. That might be too harsh for Fable though, players may complain that the difficulty just went through the roof. Oh well, leave it for my game.

But those are my ideas, can't just let anyone use them, plus they don't have the right formula to work out damage. My system is VERY complicated.