Archers kinda suck..?

[Jinksy]

So I’ve got my Archer halfway through SoA, but I’m seriously thinking about restarting with a Barbarian. As far as I can see, there’re no +3 (or more) enchanted arrows in SoA, and hardly any in ToB (I haven’t reached that yet, so that’s an assumption based on the equipment pages here), and +2 ones are rare. So whenever I fight against powerful enemies I basically have to equip the Tansheron or Gesen bow - but for some reason, the archery bonuses don’t seem to apply to Tansheron - at level 11, I’m averaging about 4 damage per shot with it. For some reason that eludes me, I get the impression the Gesen bow is much the same. Meanwhile Minsc and even Cernd are regularly whacking things for 15-20 per hit.

Am I missing something, or is this a fair evaluation? Seems like the Archer looks nice on paper but just doesn’t work in the game (keeping in mind he's got to be useful through ToB, too).

On a completely unrelated note, I’ve noticed an annoying bug in Cernd’s werewolf animation (which also afflicted my shapechanged druid and Jaheira’s bear form) - often when they’re moving, the animation just cuts off, and they slide along the ground. It’s not game-ruining, but it damages the atmosphere a fair bit. Is there anything I can do about it?

[fable]

I recall +2 ammunition being relatively easy to find, even in the early quests. In addition, there's various other great ammo, like the dispelling arrows.

[Coot]

And in ToB, +3 and even +4 arrows and bolts are quite common.

[keaper]

i've finished both SoA and ToB with an archer and he had 45% of the kills in my party, did all the lure pulls and could solo beholders, mind flayers, and even the weak liches...

about the ammo, thats depends alot..you can find arrows +1 or +2 everywhere, watcher's keep is filled with +3 also, and you can count on dispelling arrows (thats BIG when fighting spellcasters) and all the other element arrows and some others, which make all monsters pretty easy to damage if you use the right ammo. Also, if you don't want to worry about it just grab the Gesen bow or a Firetooth and don't use ammo at all, i'm still about to see a monster immune to my archer's damage.

[Punkatt]

Well about the damage thing. If I`m not mistaken streanthg or how ever its spelled applies to long bows and its breatheren so that might be a considerant.

[dj_venom]

And in TOB you can pick up unlimited arrows +1, which can then be upgraded to +2 and +3 if I am not mistaken.

[Jinksy]

Originally Posted by Punkatt

Well about the damage thing. If I`m not mistaken streanthg or how ever its spelled applies to long bows and its breatheren so that might be a considerant.

I thought it was dexterity for range weapons? Can anyone confirm or deny? Sounds like my guy might need a belt...

But regardless, my longbow shots are currently doing maybe 13-16 average damage compared to roughly 3-6 with Tansheron's bow.

Part of the problem might be figuring out what level of enchantment non generic magic arrows (ie. the ones that aren't called +1 Arrows or something similar). Is there a guide to arrows that specifies enchantment level somewhere?

[fable]

Originally Posted by Jinksy

I thought it was dexterity for range weapons? Can anyone confirm or deny? Sounds like my guy might need a belt...

It is dexterity.

[Raven_Song]

I think you get the additional STR bonus when using slings though

[Rhûn]

Don't forget certain bows have higher strength requirements, e.g. Strong Arm(19), Heartseeker(18/19?), even composites (18)

[VonDondu]

If Archers suck, then all Rangers suck, or come close to it. Let's suppose for the sake of argument that an Archer's special abilities are completely useless (an assumption that many players would never grant you). What do we have left? A Ranger who can only put one proficiency point instead of two points into each weapon type (excluding Two Weapon Style) and who cannot wear metal armor. Does a character like that really suck? Does one proficiency point make so much difference?

Maybe Archers don't get enough credit for their melee abilities, which despite minor penalties are still considerable. Or maybe most players treat Rangers as if they were Fighters and equip them with platemail and ignore their ability to use stealth and cast spells. If you give up the use to stealth to wear metal armor, why don't you play a Fighter instead of a Ranger?

I suppose the closest character to an Archer would be a Stalker, who gets extra Stealth points and the ability to backstab at the cost of not being able to wear metal armor. Backstabbing is nice (especially if you have a full two proficiency points, heh). But the Archer's sniping ability and use of Called Shot is arguably even better than backstabbing. So maybe Stalkers suck, too.

I played an Archer the first time I ever played Shadows of Amn. I haven't played an Archer in Throne of Bhaal. My skills as a player weren't all that great the first time I played BG2, so I couldn't see everyone's full potential. But my Archer was wiping out entire bands of enemies before they ever reached my party, and I thought that was pretty cool. The only thing I didn't like about the character was having to manage stacks and stacks and stacks of arrows.

The second and third time I played BG2, I wanted a character who could kick butt in melee. I didn't play a Ranger or a Stalker; I played a Berserker dualled to a Cleric and a Fighter dualled to a Thief, both of which were more fun than a plain old Berserker. But when you start talking about which one is the "best" and which ones "suck", you have to consider all sorts of advantages and disadvantages and special abilities, and I don't think it's possible to put them all on the same scale. If you only look at melee ability, you could put the Archer on one end of the scale and a Kensai on the other end of the scale; but if you look at special abilities, the whole picture is blurred.

[Sytze]

Originally Posted by Jinksy

But regardless, my longbow shots are currently doing maybe 13-16 average damage compared to roughly 3-6 with Tansheron's bow

Using the bow in which you are most proficient in, helps as well.


-Great THACO and damage bonuses with a ranged weapon. The Kensai of ranged weapons.
-Stacking Called Shot abilities with each round. You can strength drain an opponent like this, or lower his saving throws against spells. Either way, your enemy will not like you.
-Incredible shooting speed. Try Improved Haste on an Archer (that has called shot activated). Toss some enchanted arrows in the mix for some deadly carnage. Arrows of Dispelling work wonders against spellcasters.
-As many have already attested, your Archer is the man of the kills. 70% kills for my Archer is not an uncommon event.

Try the Archer out, he'll won't disappoint you, really. Try to keep him out of nasty one on one battles and he will act as your NPC life saver.

[Rhûn]

Once I remember playing a ranged-based party, the PC being a Bowslinger (extra ranger kit, elves only, high mastery instead of grand but with extra ability allowing extra attacks per round). I had Kivan as my archer, so thats two characters with high/grand mastery in longbows plus elven bonuses, then alongside Imoen for mage/thief abilities plus shortbow and Viconia wielding sling/mace with shield.
Therefore, you might notice I lacked a tank, but as I found it made no difference at all. With four ranged attacks, most enemies fell before any were even close to my party, and then, as someone mentioned, archer/bowslingers arent even that bad at melee, so I'd focus my high HP PC attacking with a halberd whilst the other three shot or spellcasted. Wearing ankheg platemail, he wasn't even easy to hit, and it was really fun to play, but I got a little annoyed at all the ammo-management. However with ammo belts, this isnt too bad. I think I might try this party out again....archers are cool.

[Coot]

Originally Posted by Rhûn

Therefore, you might notice I lacked a tank, but as I found it made no difference at all. With four ranged attacks, most enemies fell before any were even close to my party, and then, as someone mentioned, archer/bowslingers arent even that bad at melee, so I'd focus my high HP PC attacking with a halberd whilst the other three shot or spellcasted.

I forget: can Archers put a profiency point in two handed weapons? That'll compensate a bit.

[Rhûn]

Don't remember to be honest. But I think I had one/two points in two-handed