All Mage Group-- need help

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elenix
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All Mage Group-- need help

Postby elenix » Sun Feb 10, 2013 7:19 am

Hello

After a long while, I have decided to play again and I am thinking to create a mage group. I want to play with a rp group as well which is a gorup of 4 siblings as below;

1- Necromancer/Fighter -- Human, male-- lvl 11 Wizard, lvl 4 Fighter (with quaterstaff)
2- Illussionist/Fighter -- Human, male -- lvl 11 Wizard, lvl 4 Fighter (with long weapon)
3- Sorcerer/Fighter -- Human, male -- lvl 11 Sorceror, lvl 4 Fighter (with axe or hammer)
4 - Cleric/Rogue -- Human, female -- lvl 12 Cleric of Mask, lvl 3 Rogue (with small weapons in both hands)

Above is my plan over lvl 15. I need your ideas and maybe corrections.

Thank you in advance

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LastDanceSaloon
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Postby LastDanceSaloon » Sun Feb 10, 2013 3:25 pm

The only one which strikes me as a bit of pain to enjoy playing is the Cleric/Rogue. I can't help but think that you'll spend 3 hours re-jigging your stats at the start of the game and still not feel happy that the character is viable. Also, throughout the game, I can't help but think Cleric/Rogue will keep cancelling each other out in most decision making events such as Feats and Skill Points as well as Base Stats. It would certainly be fun trying though and I'm sure the other three could cover if things went too bad.

magisensei1
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Postby magisensei1 » Mon Feb 11, 2013 12:13 pm

Sounds like a fun and challenging group to try. My two cents is change one of the wizard specialist into a pure/mixed druid just to get a mix of arcane abilities plus while the druid has been nerfed in IWD2 the druid has some interesting spells and abilities you might want to try (plus use skills animal empathy and wilderness lore max for some new and different views of the game if you have never used these skills before). Plus there is a mod out there that fixes the spells for the druid in a different way than the PnP version but doesn't over power the druid unlike the mod that attempts to fix the shape changing ability of the druid.

As for your cleric/rogue I suggest a cleric/ranger mix instead since the ranger gets the two-handed fighting for free plus the ranger makes a good scout. Yes, the ranger has less skill point allocation than a rogue but if you want a scout than the ranger uses 1 skill point in hide/silence like the rogue - so if you are making a rogue for the purpose of scouting than a ranger is also a viable option (plus a ranger has somewhat better fighting skills/hp than a rogue). From a role-playing point of view for me at least the cleric/ranger has a more aesthetic appeal than the cleric/rogue, although the cleric/rogue back story would be interesting - imagine a healer who is also a thief ;)

In terms of fighting/weapon abilities that you mentioned for each - I also suggest the rapid shot feat with 2 stars in missiles and dash feat so they can hit and run - potentially 4 members with the rapid shot feat can do a lot of damage without having to engage in melee combat + with the assortment of magical arrows/ammo out there you won't really need to engage in melee (e.g. impact arrows for blunt damage; flame arrows and/or corrosive bullets for trolls; disruption bullets for undead etc).

One last suggestion and idea - you might want to make them all rangers mixes instead of fighters since they are family - they grew up in a family of rangers before becoming specialist in the arcane field of their choice - four rangers that can sneak up on the enemy dual wielding; using pole arms; and/or missile weapons can do some serious damage and makes for a different role playing feel instead of the fighter class which is a tad dull. And since they are all spell-casters and can't wear armor than the ranger who can only wear light armor and still be able to use his/her dual wielding skill should fit in very well with the group you are making.

Hope this gives you some different ideas for playing, have fun.

elenix
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Postby elenix » Wed Feb 13, 2013 3:42 am

Thank you so much for your answers. I will definitely take them into consideration :)

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Claudius
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Postby Claudius » Wed Feb 13, 2013 12:07 pm

You can make a druid/ rogue more easily than cleric/rogue because of the 4 skillpoints of druid. With 18 (20 tiefling) intelligence you can cover all of the rogue skills for the most part. If you are neutral evil you can wield the massive halberd of hate. Long weapons are good for backstab.
Right Speech has four aspects: 1. Not lying, but speaking the truth, 2. Avoiding rude and coarse words, but using gentle speech beneficial to the listener, 3. Not slandering, but promoting friendliness and unity, 4. Avoiding frivolous speech, but saying only what is appropriate and beneficial.

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Endugu
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Postby Endugu » Thu Feb 28, 2013 1:25 pm

Claudius wrote:You can make a druid/ rogue more easily than cleric/rogue because of the 4 skillpoints of druid. With 18 (20 tiefling) intelligence you can cover all of the rogue skills for the most part. If you are neutral evil you can wield the massive halberd of hate. Long weapons are good for backstab.


Don't characters in IWD2 (unmodded game) only receive half their standard skill points pers level, compared to other D&D games (e.g. rogue will only get 4 +INT bonus instead of 8 + INT bonus)?
I found that this makes multiclassing an effective skill-heavy character quite difficult.

elenix, I think cleric/rogue would be a fun combo to play, but yeah, can't really think of a way to make a character that is both an effective rogue and cleric at the same time. :/
If you're taking the rogue levels just for the free evasion, 2D6 sneak attack and skill boost at creation (as always, start a multiclassing character with rogue levels as a rogue!) , it's a good deal and I've done so in the past in an all-cleric playthrough. :)

If I didn't know that you chose your characters for rp reasons I'd advise to turn that fighter/sorcerer into a paladin(2)/sorceror(x) instead. The +1 to attack and +2 damage for one kind of weapon is hardly worth it later, the bonus to all saving throws however, is!

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Claudius
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Postby Claudius » Thu Feb 28, 2013 1:43 pm

Rogue gets 8 skillpoints :) Ranger/bard 6, Barb/Druid/monk? 4 Fighter/Paladin/cleric/mage/sorceror
Right Speech has four aspects: 1. Not lying, but speaking the truth, 2. Avoiding rude and coarse words, but using gentle speech beneficial to the listener, 3. Not slandering, but promoting friendliness and unity, 4. Avoiding frivolous speech, but saying only what is appropriate and beneficial.

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Endugu
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Postby Endugu » Thu Feb 28, 2013 5:01 pm

Are you really sure?

Because I checked and in IWD2, for some reason, classes receive only half the skill points they should according to the tabletop rules.
It runs down as follows:
Fighter/Paladin/Cleric/Wizard/Sorcerer: 1
Barbarian/Druid/Ranger/Monk: 2
Rogue: 4

I guess this is due to the designers thinking that with it's limited list of available skills, giving the classes their regular skill points would quickly lead to maxing every skill available.

But I also found some info that implied that this was not the case in the unpatched game. Since I've never played IWD2 without patching it first, I can't say if that's true.

Besides, IWD2 uses the D&D 3.0 ruleset, where bards and rangers only receive 4 points/level, not 6 like in D&D 3.5 - like they do in Neverwinter Nights 2 (I actually checked to see if I wasn't posting this on the wrong board :D ).

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Claudius
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Postby Claudius » Thu Feb 28, 2013 5:27 pm

You are right, I don't know what I was thinking! I think I am just taking so much intelligence + min/max to my skilled characters that I didn't notice the difference.

I think it is because there is a smaller set of skills. It really kind of reduces the power of rogue/ranger/bard. But there isn't non-combat fun pnp skills like sense motive or balance or jumping or climbing.
Right Speech has four aspects: 1. Not lying, but speaking the truth, 2. Avoiding rude and coarse words, but using gentle speech beneficial to the listener, 3. Not slandering, but promoting friendliness and unity, 4. Avoiding frivolous speech, but saying only what is appropriate and beneficial.

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Endugu
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Postby Endugu » Fri Mar 01, 2013 1:57 am

I agree. :)

I actually modded my game to give the classes their default number of skill points per level. Though I haven't completed a playthrough with it, so I can't say how it affects the gameplay.
I can see how one might think that doubling the skill points seems a bit excessive, given the smaller set of skills. It#s just that I think he reduction takes away a lot from some classes, the rogue in particular. It's a bit like halfing the fighter's bonus feats...

Anyway, back on topic! :D

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Radagar the Red
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Postby Radagar the Red » Mon May 27, 2013 11:03 am

Claudius wrote:You can make a druid/ rogue more easily than cleric/rogue because of the 4 skillpoints of druid. With 18 (20 tiefling) intelligence you can cover all of the rogue skills for the most part. If you are neutral evil you can wield the massive halberd of hate. Long weapons are good for backstab.



Just thought I would say this: The Druid/Rouge choice vs. the Cleric/Rouge choice is smart, but personally, I have gotten more use out of a Cleric than a Druid. Maybe that's just because of how I play? I think that if he changed his Necromancer/Fighter to a Necromancer/Rouge, then he would be able to have a Cleric/Fighter. I think that could work out well for him. Unless you can't have a Necromancer/Rouge...I don't remember whether or not that's possible, but I think it should work. I hope that helps! ;)
~Radagar the Red